Thoughts, essays, and writings on Liberty. Written by the heirs of Patrick Henry.

“When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic. Sell not liberty to purchase power.”     Benjamin Franklin

October 16, 2007

Is Ron Paul’s Campaign Being Hijacked By The Whacko Fringe ?

by Doug Mataconis

Over at The Huffington Post, Thomas Edsall comes pretty close to writing a smear peace when he points out the fact that Ron Paul’s campaign seems to be attracting the support of some less than desirable characters:

Through no fault of his own, Rep. Ron Paul’s anti-globalist, anti-government campaign for the Republican presidential nomination has become a magnet in neo-Nazi networks, pulling in activists and supporters from the fringe white nationalist community where anti-Semitism, anti-black and anti-immigrant views are commonplace.

In some cases, these internet-based activists acknowledge that even though the Paul campaign does not have a racist or anti-Semitic agenda, it can serve as a vehicle to find sympathizers and to recruit new loyalists drawn to the Republican congressman’s opposition to international trade agreements, federal police authority and to the income tax.

Such web-based organizations as Stormfront (motto: “White Pride, World Wide”), Vanguard News Network (“No Jews. Just Right.”) and the Nationalist Coalition (“working to create the relationships that will lay the foundation for the White community that is necessary to our survival”) have become sources of support for Paul’s bid for the Republican nomination, and in some cases have set up separate Ron Paul discussion groups.

The Paul campaign dismissed the pro-Paul activities among these groups. “We don’t know who these people are,” said Jesse Benton, Paul’s communications director. Their support has “nothing to do with Ron Paul, and what he stands for….His message of freedom, peace and prosperity – that’s why people support him.”

Paul has not made racist or anti-Semitic appeals to the controversial organizations and their members. Instead, their support is based on Paul’s libertarian opposition to government generally, including the IRS and the powers granted to the federal government under the Patriot Act – views that are shared by many on the conservative fringe of the spectrum.

As Edsall points out, of course, there’s really nothing about the Paul campaign that comes anywhere close the agenda that the white supremacists (although they like to call themselves “white pride”) groups are advocating. Instead, what has happened, as I pointed out when the Stormfront ad became an issue last week, is that groups like these seem to be taking advantage of the decentralized nature of the campaign to latch their own agenda on to the campaign. And it’s not just the racists who are doing it, you can say the same thing about the 9/11 “truth” crowd, even though the Congressman has made it clear he doesn’t agree with them.

Edsall, being a typical Huffington Post contributor, tries to ascribe all this to Paul’s views on the issues:

The white nationalist and anti-Semitic support flowing to the Paul campaign reflects one of the difficulties facing candidates who do not fall into the midstream: that often their views on less controversial subjects like trade and the power of the federal government to take property through eminent domain also appeal to extremist groups.

Which comes pretty close to what leftists usually say about conservatives and libertarians — you’re ideas are invalid because you’re racist. Here’ Edsall can’t go that far, so he simply makes the implication and let’s the reader draw the conclusion.

Rather than the ideas being the problem, though, Jeff Cammaroto thinks its the campaign strategy that’s partially to blame:

The problem is, it seems like the campaign has been more than happy to welcome outsiders to spread its message online. That might seem like a great idea at first but when messages are not vetted by an official source, it is only a matter of time before some people rise up and exploit them.

Which, it seems, is what’s happened in this case.

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59 Comments

  1. The “campaign strategy” is to accept people who agree with him on one issue or all issues. Since his fundamental ideology in this campaign is, “follow the Constitution”, I fail to see where whackos enter into the equation. If they, too, want to follow the Constitution, and they also believe that drinking urine is a homeopathic remedy, who gives a shit?

    It’s only an issue for people with poor critical thinking skills who think guilt-by-association is a compelling argument all by itself.

    Comment by rho — October 16, 2007 @ 10:58 pm
  2. Rho,

    You see, the problem I have is that I don’t want to be associated with people like the idiots at Stormfront.

    And I would think the Paul campaign would feel the same way.

    Comment by Doug Mataconis — October 16, 2007 @ 11:08 pm
  3. Everyone is an idiot to someone.

    Comment by Flo — October 16, 2007 @ 11:19 pm
  4. Interesting smear piece at the Huffington Post. Are they aware that Mitt Romney belongs to a cult?

    Comment by Dave Marshall — October 16, 2007 @ 11:24 pm
  5. Doug, please don’t do my thinking for me. Thank you.

    Comment by Larry — October 16, 2007 @ 11:27 pm
  6. Look big picture, Doug.

    No matter what we feel about them, the so-called “fringe” supporters provided the energy and the money for this campaign to get off the ground. It wouldn’t have even been possible and we need to recognize and appreciate that.

    Now, looking forward, it won’t be a problem.
    - The campaign has never actually embraced them, so it will be easy to distance them when it comes time for a rock’em sock’em campaign.
    - We’re picking up mainstream supporters now, so the “fringe” supporters will methodically become minorites as we get closer to show time.

    So, relax. We’re right on schedule.

    P.S. We just hit 5% in the Gallup poll. http://www.usatoday.com/news/polls/tables/live/2007-10-15-poll.htm?loc=interstitialskip
    Plot the poll numbers in a chart and you’ll clearly see a curve progressing geometrically upward. Considering the positive press lately and the cash to spend, Paul will be approaching the tipping point by the end of the year if this country cares even the least bit about small govt.

    Comment by Jeff Molby — October 16, 2007 @ 11:30 pm
  7. At it again eh? The point is Americans are Americans. Irrelavant is the issue of if their views are popular. Everyone has the right to be themselves, and say what they like. The line comes when they force their views upon others, harming them. The real racisim is catagorizing, then stripping away constituional rights such as freedom of speech based upon that clasification. Ron Paul earned much respect from me when talking to Truthers like everyone else, listening to their concerns and responding honestly. Even though he doesn’t agree with their view, he doesn’t try to behave like that makes him somehow superior. Other politicians should learn from his example.

    Comment by James Adams — October 16, 2007 @ 11:32 pm
  8. Doug’s stuff gets ooooooold.

    “Attracting” the support of an unseemly, to Doug, group is now equivalent to a campaign being “hijacked by” the unseemly group. Wow.

    Comment by C. Wesley Fowler — October 16, 2007 @ 11:44 pm
  9. If there was such a thing as guilt by association… I would point out that Prescott Bush grandad to the president was the director of a Bank seized by the FBI in 1942 for being a NAZI bank… google it..
    Plus George Bush was WITH Bin-laden on 9-11… GWB helped in gettin around a hundred Bin-ladens out of the Country 4 dayz after 9-11.. and still hangs out and holds hands with all the Saudi Oil princes who funnel money to all the terrorist..
    Then there is the U.S. military support with Noreiga, The Shah, Saddam, Stalin, etc… etc… etc.. etcc

    To think that WHEN Dr. Ron Paul WINS the presidency… there will be a whole ERA when things like the above WON’T be taking place.

    Comment by atvdude — October 16, 2007 @ 11:56 pm
  10. There’s something to be said for a candidate that can bring diverse and opposing groups together to support the Constitution, individual liberty, and free markets. I think it’s great that they’re supporting him. Paul will be a good influence on them.

    Comment by Drena — October 16, 2007 @ 11:59 pm
  11. The race card is the liberal’s first and last card. It sucks to live like that.

    Comment by Willis Williams — October 17, 2007 @ 12:00 am
  12. I see the campaign’s most recent activity pulling away from the fringe more than anything. Ever since Paul pulled $5 million in the last quarter the press has been paying more attention to what he’s actually saying than to his followers, he’s made appearances on PBS, Wolf Blitzer, FoxNews. He’s getting his message out there himself and not depending on his supporters alone for dissemination. I have no idea where your latest stream of negativity is coming from, Doug, but frankly it appears to me that the campaign’s getting a lot more positive exposure in mainstream circles and moving in the exact opposite direction of what you’re describing…especially since Paul seems to be weathering the storm of the primary far better than Romney or McCain.

    And Wesley’s right…the fact that a fringe group endorses Paul does not indicate that they’ve hijacked his campaign. This pessimism is getting old and I think it’s becoming increasingly inaccurate.

    Comment by UCrawford — October 17, 2007 @ 12:05 am
  13. Man, old is right! LOL

    Ron Paul’s campaign is being hijacked by EVERYONE!

    He’s about to raise $1 mill in the first two weeks of October. Go check his site and donate. If he has the $1 mill by tomorrow morning, he’ll have even more to discuss during his press conference.

    Last I looked it was up to $993,000

    Comment by Paul — October 17, 2007 @ 12:07 am
  14. I welcome the “less desirable” fringe supporters with open arms. It’s because of men like Ron Paul who defend the Constitution that we even have the freedom to express our beliefs, however “wacko” people make them out to be. What’s so awesome about Ron Paul’s campaign is how it is bringing such diverse groups of people together who recognize their differences in beliefs and know how important it is to fight for them.

    Comment by Jaime — October 17, 2007 @ 12:09 am
  15. “Paul will be a good influence on them.”

    Comment by Drena — October 16, 2007 @ 11:59 pm

    Comment by choi — October 17, 2007 @ 12:19 am
  16. The MSM who controls everything will smeer Ron Paul because he will look out for American’s intrests first and will not take money from foreign interests. Scott Ritter said it best.

    http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/113.html

    Comment by Joe — October 17, 2007 @ 12:27 am
  17. Didn’t Ron Paul attend the All-American Presidential Forums, a debate sponsored by AfroAmericans? Had there been a poll after this debate and Ron Paul had won, would he have been seen a racist, since a large group of AfroAmericans would be seen as supporting him and many AfroAmericans are not that far from being “Black Supremasist”. But I’m guessing that would be ok, because if anyone did complain the NAACP would be all over their butts…

    But why is it ok that the Latin community can endorse a candidate, the Black community can endorse a candidate, both groups can openly support their race above other races, and then the White community is demonized for doing such?

    Comment by John Coffee — October 17, 2007 @ 12:33 am
  18. Well, so what? If the nut jobs end up putting Paul in office, they’ll be in for quite a surprise!!

    BTR

    Comment by Butler T Reynolds — October 17, 2007 @ 12:34 am
  19. More hit pieces and smears, please! Every time someone publishes one, it inspires ordinary Americans to contribute money to the campaign.

    Comment by Matt C — October 17, 2007 @ 12:42 am
  20. White Nationalists seem to be supporting Ron Paul. Guess what? Black Nationalists are supporting Barack Obama. Why no story on that? Should Obama be smeared in the same way because of some of HIS “fringe” supporters?

    I’m tired of the thought police mentality. No matter how you feel about White Nationalists, they are guilty of no crime for simply believing what they do. Our Commander in Chief, however, HAS committed crimes – several of them. It’s HIM I’d most prefer not to be associated with.

    Comment by Savannah — October 17, 2007 @ 12:46 am
  21. This blog is getting tedious. If you want a list of racists that support the democrats, let me know.

    Now, about the L.O.S.T. Treaty which even GLENN BECK was railing about tonight — this is not a fringe issue, it’s a real threat to the USA when you let the UN crazies take over 70% of the earth’s surface and give them the POWER TO TAX US.

    Comment by NH — October 17, 2007 @ 12:52 am
  22. I refer you all to a previous post I made in spoof reference to Venus and Mars and Hillary Clinton. That says it all…

    Comment by tannim — October 17, 2007 @ 1:48 am
  23. Doug, just stop it! I have been reading your liberty Paper pieces on RP since you started posting them and they are simply a waist of energy. The very essence of this piece aides in answering the question you pose favorably. Can’t you focus your energy up the chain of precendence and onto more important issues… After all, we are talking about an extraordinary campaign! Shame on you.

    Comment by Think Smartly — October 17, 2007 @ 1:56 am
  24. YOur Commander in Chief, however, HAS committed crimes – several of them. It’s HIM I’d most prefer not to be associated with.

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/cheney/

    Comment by js290 — October 17, 2007 @ 1:59 am
  25. Who cares who you want to be associated with, Doug? For being the center of a site dedicated to liberty, you seem to be missing a fundamental piece of the puzzle: an actual understanding of liberty.

    Comment by Samj — October 17, 2007 @ 3:06 am
  26. Pretty laughable Doug. Seems Paul is so squeaky clean that the GOP death machine has no other recourse.

    The RP campaign is still months away from hitting critical mass. Can’t wait to see the PTB machine’s next move.

    SMELL THE FEAR.

    Comment by GeneG — October 17, 2007 @ 4:26 am
  27. Doug, The Paul campaign dismissed the racist groups activities. What else do you want the campaign to do? How can they stop people from posting pro-Paul items on-line? As for you not wanting to be associated with such people, your secret is safe with us, none of us will tell anyone that you’re a Paul supporter. (Believe me you hide it well.) As you know politics makes strange bed fellows. If you step back from it its kind of funny that a libertarian is being endorsed by nazis.
    Make sure they’ve all registered Republican (so they can vote for Paul) and make sure they leave their swastikas at home when they’re handing out slimjims.

    Comment by Bob — October 17, 2007 @ 5:06 am
  28. Bob,

    At some point, the campaign is going to have to become more of a centralized organization than it is now. You can’t win primaries by relying up YouTube and Meetup.

    Why not start doing it sooner rather than later ?

    Comment by Doug Mataconis — October 17, 2007 @ 5:39 am
  29. As long as “Stormfront” leaves other people and their property alone, I could care less about them. Unfortunately there will always be morons in the world.

    That said, if they are going to vote, I’d rather they vote for the guy that I am voting for;o)

    Comment by Jason — October 17, 2007 @ 5:52 am
  30. I wouldn’t worry too much about these idiots that post these smear tactics.

    All i have to say is, if this is thye best you people can do to smear Ron Paul YOU ARE ALL IN BIG TROUBLE.

    I love how anyone can say that supporting the constitution and the advice of our founding fathers that we are now whacko’s.

    For the record i have been a democrat all my life and am a doctor by profession so if loving my country and supporting and protecting the constitution classfies me as a whacko SO BE IT.

    GOD BLESS AMERICA AND GOD BLESS DR. RON PAUL

    Comment by Steve — October 17, 2007 @ 6:50 am
  31. By the way i forgot to mention that i changed my party to Republican just so i could vote for Ron Paul.

    Comment by Steve — October 17, 2007 @ 6:51 am
  32. Doug, I think Paul is moving to a more centralized campaign, but that isn’t going to stop groups like Stromfront from supporting him. Paul’s opponents will be very happy to highlight that support.
    Salute Victory! Salute Paul! :-)

    Comment by Bob — October 17, 2007 @ 7:25 am
  33. You must love all the traffic you get by posting nasty comments against Dr. Ron Paul. Instead, why don’t you write articles on your anointed one Mr. Cross-dressing, married three times, married his cousin, out of a job Giuliani. Every New Yorker that I know will be voting for Dr. Ron Paul, not power hungry Hillery and the other guy I just mentioned.

    Ron Paul 2008 A man of honesty and integrity~

    Comment by Paul — October 17, 2007 @ 7:28 am
  34. Hey Doug,

    This strategy is going to backfire.

    The entire political structure is currently based on the big lie that white people who want to grow up in communities like the ones they were raised in are EEEEEEVVVIIILLLLL “supremacists” when what they want is the essential freedom demanded by everyone from libertarians to the Founding Fathers: freedom of territorial association.

    Drawing attention to these ‘whackos’ the way you do is merely pushing to the fore in people’s minds the contradictions of the current PC supremacy:

    Due to Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965 (along with some court decisions), innocent white people are denied their right raise their children in communities like the ones they were raised in.

    It is not THEY who are EEEEVVVIIILLLL supremacists — it is the political establishment that is filled with EEEEEVIILLLLL PC supremacists like yourself.

    Comment by James Bowery — October 17, 2007 @ 7:40 am
  35. Hi Doug,

    You know I have of recent came to your defense when someone attacked your with obscene and profane gestures. I must admit I have never meet any Paul supporter who is such a negative person as you confirm. You are kinda like the cartoon character who says “nobody’s my friend.”

    Though I’m not attacking you personally I simply attacking your attitude.

    Thus far I have not seen the MSM even disuse the wackos “Stormfront” and thanks to you I would have never known who they were until I read your former post. But now we see another post about an issues which isn’t even support by Paul. Many of us over the past months have questioned your actual support of Dr. Paul. Some of us have even concluded at one time or another that your actions are liken to the behavior of a troll. As time passes it sure does look as if you are a troll. But you say your not but perhaps my last question will serve as the direction we should take to confirm your true support of Ron Paul.

    For those of you who may wonder just return to Doug’s former posts and read them.

    Did you know that in 1996 the department of education competed a study regarding drugs in schools and they found that the use of drugs among high school students actually increased after the local police departments from around the nation began to teach “Just say no to drugs”?

    Are you also aware that in 2001 the department of education completed another study regarding suicide. They found when counselors who visited student class rooms to discuss suicide that the suicide rates actually increased just a few months after the mini-class?

    Doug my point is this… Why poison the water when it isn’t needed. You know that Ron Paull doesn’t support neo-nazi networks so why spend your time on this?

    It’s real simple I predicted three months ago that Paul would post 5-5.5 million for the 3rd qtr. I also predicted his meet-up groups would increase by 25% and it exceeded it. Why not count the blessings of Paul’s success then provide negative examples that he can’t controll? For example: PBS interview, Wolf Blitzer ( did you know who is former FBI or CIA I can’t remember which one) Fox News, Tucker, Washington Post, Nation, and many other sources.

    I also shared with you the fact that Straw Polls have always been critical, yet this time they focus more on the other polls which hide Paul’s real numbers. I have also shared with you I have a DVD which is coming out soon and we interview some major GOP members in former election cycles and all conclude the focus on other polls is a method used to suppress Paul’s numbers. I also have a major whistle blower who will confirm that one of the major polling sources has been playing the numbers and he is in the video. I just can’t release it until he finds another job. It should be major news in the weeks to come. Once he has transition to another job we will post the DVD on google video and I will provide a link. I also have a voter from the recent Iowa straw poll who has some very interesting Paul news and some tricks few realized until recently regarding Paul’s 5th place win.

    Doug, if we were to pull up the donor list of Ron Paul 2008 supporters would we see your name for this years campaign contributions?

    Comment by Darel99 — October 17, 2007 @ 8:14 am
  36. Jesus was condemned for associating with whores and vagabonds. I’m not implying anything religious about Ron Paul, but on a sociological level, Jesus brought together a very diverse and sometimes criminal group – because of his irresistable message of truth, peace, and love.

    Many Zionists and hardcore Evangelists support fanatical, anti-Muslim Republicans. Many probably support Tancrado’s contention that the US President should be willing to nuke Mecca in the case of another terrorist attack on US soil.

    If ‘fringe’ groups are excited by a Paul candidacy, maybe that is because they recognize the value of electing a president that will uphold the oath of office. The job of the President is to protect and defend the Constitution from enemies foreign and domestic, and rascists may support a principled President.

    Comment by rhys — October 17, 2007 @ 8:33 am
  37. Subject: The better angels of the people

    People drawn to Storm Front come from a minority that is disenfranchised in media, government, religion, society and culture. Their grievances are entirely legitimate if you take the time to study them. Their complaint is sometimes distored by bitterness and their solutions sometimes, polluted by short sightedness and ignorance. Sound like any other group or individual you know? Ever sound like you or me? If you would cleanse that pollution, then support Dr. Paul’s solution to the disenfranchisement of minorities.

    Other minorities suffer equally but we do not question them. The Republicans have been marching in lock step with lunacy. Dr. Paul does accept or rubber stamp their lunacy but seeks to move that party away from lunacy and towards decency. When people say to me, “isn’t he a Republican”, I say, He’s no more a Republican than I am a black man. The question is whether Ron Paul’s appeal to the better angels of the Republican party will make them into good Americans. If so, might not his appeal that draws Strom Fronters, make them into a better minority?

    So-called “libertarians” make my skin crawl. The great foundation of their system of believe is repudiation of Lincoln predicated on complete ignorance of the accomplishments of the 16th President and blaming him for the perfidy of those who came before and after him. But I can do business with libertarians without, myself, repudiating Lincoln, so long as they embrace and defend the American laws and values that Lincoln, and I might add, Dr. Paul, embody.

    The so-called, “Christian right” lurches into lunacy more often than not in recent decades. But again, people are drawn to the Christian churches for legitimate reasons which are then mapped onto lunatic distortions.

    In all these cases, and multitudes more, Paul does what Lincoln did. He appeals to the better angels of the people. Christians weren’t fond of Lincoln because he infringed on their claim to moral authority. But appealing to the better angels of the people is at the heart of real Christianity. It forgives sins and nourishes the goodness that is inherent in people so that the good will overcome the evil.

    Every minority and every individual has its moral, spiritual and intellectual baggage which can be easily condemned. We could revive racism, and Storm Fronters admittedly do, by condemning all black men and women for the lunacy of scum like Al Sharpton and “the Reverend” Jessie Jackson or the human frailty of the rank and file of any minority. But note that Storm Fronters do not disavow Ron Paul because of his black constituents. In this, perhaps we righteous folk might learn a lesson from our wayward brothers and sisters at Storm Front.

    The Ron Paul Revolution is not about establishing a new oligarchy composed of the “right sort” of minorities. It is about appealing to the better angels of all minorities to establish a new union of free men and women. It is not Storm Front but us, who do not belong in the Ron Paul Revolution if we wish to silence and exclude any minority from the American union.

    And let’s get real. Storm Fronters talk like Nazis but act like Americans. They are driven to extreme solutions by the extreme reality of the fascist usurpation of America’s free institutions. The current Administration talks like Americans but acts like Nazis. Let us know them by the fruits they bare and repudiate the real enemy.

    Neocons use the slogan “United we stand”. United behind what? and who do you mean by “we”. I don’t stand united behind any action of the current or recent administrations or congresses. Nor does Ron Paul stand behind the Storm Front ideology. But if Storm Fronters, individuals, unite behind the Ron Paul agenda of liberty, then they will be cleansed of any offensive extremes.

    Nobody says that Ron Paul is going to win in this appeal to the better angels of the people.

    Signed,
    nobody

    Comment by Larry Ward — October 17, 2007 @ 8:35 am
  38. Just remember that when Ron Paul wins, smear campaigns such as this one will be used as evidence to put people like you in prison for a long time, for trying to disrupt the democratic process for personal gain.

    Comment by Don Corleone — October 17, 2007 @ 8:43 am
  39. The irony is that nothing could be further from Nazi idealogy than a strong adherence to the Constitution. Obviously Nazi’s believe in violence and propaganda, so one could possibly draw better parallels with our current administration than with their number one critic in Congress over the last 6 years (Dr. Paul). But I’m sure the mainstreamers will run with this foolishness as another way of attacking the good doctor and populist message. Anything to subvert the truth on behalf of the elite and keep the globalist agenda on track.

    Comment by NEC — October 17, 2007 @ 9:10 am
  40. Who do the Jewish and Black supremacist groups that exist in D.C. and around the country support for president?

    Why hasn’t it been mentioned that those fringe groups have, at least in the past, been infiltrated and run by spooks?

    Which are you more scared of, “white pride” folks or Muslims?

    Is the timing of the ‘hanging nooses’, the Stormfront endorsement and consequent smears against Ron Paul just a big coincidence?

    White pride folks have a right to be white pride. They have a right to vote. As long as they don’t hurt anyone then they have a right to dislike darkness. I borderline hate people who are dumb enough to hate on Ron Paul for what a few hicks say. Christ, we have people who want the federal government to stand behind their right to murder babies, who are they voting for? Aren’t they just as whacko as the white pride hicks?

    Comment by Curtis — October 17, 2007 @ 9:30 am
  41. Which are you more scared of, “white pride” folks or Muslims?

    Frankly, I have serious doubts about anyone who thinks that the color of their skin or what ethnic group they belong to is a rational basis for classifying themselves or other people.

    Comment by Doug Mataconis — October 17, 2007 @ 9:33 am
  42. Storm Fronters talk like Nazis but act like Americans

    An oxymoron if I ever heard one.

    Comment by Doug Mataconis — October 17, 2007 @ 9:34 am
  43. Darel,

    Why poison the water when it isn’t needed. You know that Ron Paull doesn’t support neo-nazi networks so why spend your time on this?

    Because no political campaign can afford to allow itself become so decentralized that any nutcase can promote his own agenda using the candidates name, which is what’s happening here.

    Comment by Doug Mataconis — October 17, 2007 @ 9:35 am
  44. You must love all the traffic you get by posting nasty comments against Dr. Ron Paul. Instead, why don’t you write articles on your anointed one Mr. Cross-dressing, married three times, married his cousin, out of a job Giuliani. Every New Yorker that I know will be voting for Dr. Ron Paul, not power hungry Hillery and the other guy I just mentioned.

    Do a search on this site for articles about Rudy Giuliani and you’ll see just what I think about him.

    Comment by Doug Mataconis — October 17, 2007 @ 9:36 am
  45. Doug,

    “Because no political campaign can afford to allow itself become so decentralized that any nutcase can promote his own agenda using the candidates name, which is what’s happening here.”

    That would be happening if Paul was still getting no air time on any of the major networks, which isn’t the case any more. The more exposure he gets, the less this will be a problem because Paul has disassociated himself from the racists and his platform only coincides with theirs on the issue of immigration.

    Beyond that, the only connection between Paul, the truthers and the racists is that none of them particularly seem to like big government, which is common ground with the libertarians as well. Should Paul abandon that message so he can alienate all the voters you don’t like? And frankly the blog world is the only place I ever see this Ron Paul = racism argument brought up…why on earth would you even consider it newsworthy?

    As for Paul’s view on racism, I think he explained pretty clearly why he isn’t racist and why he doesn’t go out of his way to demonize opposing points of view on the topic in this article he wrote for Lew Rockwell after the Imus incident:

    http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul381.html

    Comment by UCrawford — October 17, 2007 @ 9:56 am
  46. For those who might like more info:
    (0. Ron Paul: A New Hope) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FG2PUZoukfA
    (1. National Threat) http://www.ronpaulnation.com/tv.html#controller_general_david_walker
    (2. True cost of gas) http://www.terrarossa.com/?p=225
    (3. America: Freedom to Fascism) http://www.freedomtofascism.com
    (4. The Secret Government…) http://bullnotbull.blogspot.com/2007/01/secret-government-bill-moyers.html
    (5. Truth about Giuliani) http://www.rudy-urbanlegend.com/
    (6. CIA drug dealing) http://youtube.com/watch?v=1l31x-IIK4E
    (7. Civil Liberties Lost) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8QwTKKSvR8&mode=related&search=
    (8. Money Masters) http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-515319560256183936
    (9. Iraq War: Legal or Illegal) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Khut8xbXK8&mode=related&search=

    Book list from Ron Paul recommended reading for Giuliani:
    - Imperial Hubris by Michael Scheuer
    - Dying to Win, by Robert Pape
    - Blowback, by Chalmers Johnson
    - 9/11 Commission Report
    - 1984, by George Orwell

    http://ronpaulregistry.com/2.0
    Be counted!

    Comment by ItsHappening — October 17, 2007 @ 10:24 am
  47. Because no political campaign can afford to allow itself become so decentralized that any nutcase can promote his own agenda using the candidates name, which is what’s happening here.

    Actually, the girl didn’t do that. She was promoting Ron Paul’s agenda. Yes, she pointed out the parts that related to her agenda, but she actually did a pretty good job of staying on message. She didn’t put a single word in his mouth.

    Comment by Jeff Molby — October 17, 2007 @ 10:31 am
  48. BTW, Doug, you are going to post about the new poll numbers, right?

    Comment by Jeff Molby — October 17, 2007 @ 10:32 am
  49. “Frankly, I have serious doubts about anyone who thinks that the color of their skin or what ethnic group they belong to is a rational basis for classifying themselves or other people.”

    I hear ya on that, to some extent. It’s hard to deny that often with a change in skin color or ethnicity comes a change in culture. The fact that I’m white ranks low on my list when it comes to classifying myself.

    I’m human. I’m an American. I’m a Deist. I know that the only real difference between me and a starving African kid is the geographic location of my birthplace. I got lucky. Give that same kid the opportunities that I’ve had and he’d probably be much further ahead in life than I am. This cracker is admittedly half-idiot. I can understand why supremacist or “pride” groups exist though. Put me in the “weed pride” and “human pride” groups. The government needs up ease up off and leave people to lead their own lives. The more they try to force prescription pills and Government Health Care down my throat the more likely I am to become more extreme in my “weed pride” views. The more innocent people who go to jail over this War on Drugs the more likely I am to hate the War on Drugs and those who perpetrate it.

    I just, I dunno, try to at least understand where the “pride” folks come from with their anger. I think that’s the key in addressing the issues in the most peaceful and logical manner. Put EVERYONE on equal footing in the eyes of the law, then there is absolutely no excuses for the bullcrap that some groups pull.

    Besides, if Stormfront hates black people so much then why would they support a guy who is going to decriminalize and release from prison thousands upon thousands upon thousands of black people who’ve been imprisoned by a racist War on Drugs? Why would they support Ron Paul? They just want to be left alone. He’d alleviate a large amount of the stress and anger which fuels supremacist movements.

    Comment by Curtis — October 17, 2007 @ 10:33 am
  50. Out of ALL the candidates, Republican or Democrat, Dr. Paul is the _LEAST_ racist out of all of them, not favoring any group over another. How many other candidates go on and on about the need to “protect Israel from the Arabs?” Lumping all the Arab nations and peoples into the “bad guys” category is about as racist as it gets! And that’s not me being PC, it’s just the unvarnished truth.

    I’d say a lot of the neo-Nazi and other groups just like the fact that American taxpayer dollars wouldn’t be spent to subsidize Israel anymore. As strongly as I _disagree_ with their motives, the financial result is still non-intervention. Israel is a sovereign nation that has every right to defend its existence and its borders, but PAYING FOR IT isn’t America’s job. They have at least a hundred nukes and one of the strongest military presences in the region. I say they’re a country that can fend for itself. I don’t like my tax dollars funding Israel’s abuse of the Palestinian people any more than I like to subsidize obscenities like corporate welfare for the oil & energy industries. If anyone is supported by racists FOR RACIST REASONS, it’s the politicians in the pocket of AIPAC, the JRC, and so on.
    And before anyone tries to claim my views are anti-semitic I’ll have you know I have MANY Jewish friends I respect very much, my boss is a Jew, and I _strongly_ support Israel’s right to exist as a country – but not its lobbyists’ feeling of entitlement to welfare money from MY taxes.

    Comment by Dave E. — October 17, 2007 @ 10:44 am
  51. The only people who should be ashamed are the people who write articles like this and give these groups undeserved attention. It’s certainly not any of Ron Paul’s doing simply because he supports liberty for EVERYONE. I suppose all of Paul’s black supporters, of which he has MANY, are racist too since they support the same candidate the white supremacists support?

    Comment by Thomas — October 17, 2007 @ 11:16 am
  52. [...] Thomas Edsall at The Huffington Post comments on white supremacist support for Ron Paul. Doug Mataconis, who has pretty much become the go-to guy for news of weirdness within the Paul movement, comments here. [...]

    Pingback by The Crossed Pond » Perils of a grassroots campaign, part III: The Scum Also Rises — October 17, 2007 @ 11:22 am
  53. Blackwater supports Hillary.
    Suadi Arabia kleptocracy supports Guiliani.
    The Bin Laden family is friends with George Bush.
    Rumsfeld was photographed having a backslapping good time with Sadam Hussein.

    Out of the millions of Ron Paul supporters there are some racists….from what I can tell Ron Paul is at a further distance from his bad supporters than the other guys are. So why are you applying your smear job of a article unevenly? Not a very balanced article.

    Comment by Gabe Harris — October 17, 2007 @ 2:28 pm
  54. We cannot control who likes us. If a girl has a crush on me and later murders her children should I issue a press release to say “i’m not a child killer”. Please!

    This is the kind of carp the other campaigns want you talking about instead of staying focused and on task.

    Comment by your mother — October 17, 2007 @ 2:57 pm
  55. Jeff is right. I thought the girl in the video made excellent points and stuck on message for Ron Paul.

    She has a right.

    Comment by NH — October 17, 2007 @ 6:10 pm
  56. I love how desperate the MSM is getting. I have NEVER gave one penny to a candidate, but I have given Ron Paul $100 and I intend on giving a $100 more.

    Tens of thousands of Americans are doing the same.

    Paul said that educating a future generation to understand freedom and planting the seeds of individual liberty are more important than this campaign.

    If the excitement generated by his message is any indication of our future, I would say we have finally found a bright spot!

    Paul makes Limbaugh, Hannity, Bush, Clinton, and Rudi Tuti all look like uneducated and unprincipled, ideological whackos.

    Comment by Joseph Zrnchik — October 17, 2007 @ 6:48 pm
  57. You see, the problem I have is that I don’t want to be associated with people like the idiots at Stormfront.

    I would suggest you not endorse them then.

    Ron Paul hasn’t.

    Comment by Akston — October 17, 2007 @ 7:48 pm
  58. You don’t want to be associated with people like the idiots at Stormfront? Then don’t associate with them. You choose with whom you associate.

    However, you only choose for yourself. You don’t get to choose with whom they associate. They get to choose to associate with whomsoever they please, or it ceases to be a free country. They get to say whatever kind of idiotic things they wish, even if those ideas repel you, or it ceases to be a free country. Some would say that the free country ceased rather a long time ago.

    Ron Paul has not endorsed these people. And, if he gets campaign contributions from them, good. I can think of a lot worse things that such people might do with their money.

    The truth of a big tent is, it has a lot of people under it. If it is big enough to get Ron Paul to the White House, the Revolution is going to have a bunch of unsavory people around the edges. Some are going to be more religious than thee or me, some are going to be more pro-Life than thee or me, some are going to be more self-sovereign than thee, some are going to be inclined to want a smaller government for “bad” reasons.

    I don’t care. I want a much, much smaller government. I want fewer taxes taking less from me. I want monetary policy to be made on sensible, free market principles. I want free trade. I personally don’t think the border issue is that big a deal. I don’t mind immigrants coming here to work. I don’t think Paul is perfect on every issue. So what?

    What are my choices? It isn’t like there’s a sovereign individual candidate.

    You don’t want to be associated with people like the idiots at Stormfront? Fine. Don’t be. But, does that mean you have to support a candidate who is worse in some way than Ron Paul? Then you would become the foolish one.

    Get a grip. Other people are going to join the Ron Paul Revolution whether you like them or not. You ought to like them joining, and more of them, if you want to win.

    Comment by Jim Davidson — October 17, 2007 @ 8:40 pm
  59. You know….this didn’t strike me as a hit piece at all, but some reasonable reporting on how some unsavory groups are coalescing around the Paul campaign. The author goes to great pains to note that this “through no fault of his own”, and I think the conclusions and observations are quite reasonable.

    There are plenty of hit pieces out there on Dr. Paul and it seems to me an unnecessary distraction to impute an attack where none exists.

    Comment by Stephen — October 17, 2007 @ 9:02 pm

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