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	<title>Comments on: Iran: Rhetoric And Reality</title>
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	<description>Life. Liberty. Property. Defending individual freedom and liberty, one post at a time.</description>
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		<title>By: js290</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41689</link>
		<dc:creator>js290</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Oct 2007 03:52:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41689</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/showdown/]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/showdown/" rel="nofollow">http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/showdown/</a></p>
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		<title>By: js290</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41522</link>
		<dc:creator>js290</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 06:25:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41522</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt;It has been in a slow, steady freefall for some years now, and that fall is likely to continue now for the foreseeable future.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

The &quot;enforcers&quot; have been deployed to help slow the free fall... I wonder how much weaker the dollar would be if it wasn&#039;t the world&#039;s reserve currency?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>It has been in a slow, steady freefall for some years now, and that fall is likely to continue now for the foreseeable future.</p></blockquote>
<p>The &#8220;enforcers&#8221; have been deployed to help slow the free fall&#8230; I wonder how much weaker the dollar would be if it wasn&#8217;t the world&#8217;s reserve currency?</p>
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		<title>By: UCrawford</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41513</link>
		<dc:creator>UCrawford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 05:49:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41513</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Actually, the really pathetic thing is that Bush&#039;s treaty with North Korea is actually weaker than the Agreed Framework Clinton set up with them in the 1990s (the one that we reneged on by not providing the lightwater reactors).  So after all that bluster and all the threats, Bush ended up putting us in a worse position than the one we were in prior to him taking office.  He is such a pathetic failure.

And it&#039;s not like he even needed to negotiate the settlement with the North Koreans.  The nuke they set off was so weak we could barely confirm it as a nuclear explosion.  After that Kim Jong-il almost immediately sent out his negotiators, indicating that the test was a massive failure, and considering the state of North Korea&#039;s economy it&#039;s unlikely he had the capability to improve his program or build more.  Basically, we could have just sat back, kept our mouths shut and let his society collapse on its own.  Now we&#039;re propping them up with foreign aid because Bush thinks Kim Jong-il might someday be a threat to us.  Utterly ridiculous.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually, the really pathetic thing is that Bush&#8217;s treaty with North Korea is actually weaker than the Agreed Framework Clinton set up with them in the 1990s (the one that we reneged on by not providing the lightwater reactors).  So after all that bluster and all the threats, Bush ended up putting us in a worse position than the one we were in prior to him taking office.  He is such a pathetic failure.</p>
<p>And it&#8217;s not like he even needed to negotiate the settlement with the North Koreans.  The nuke they set off was so weak we could barely confirm it as a nuclear explosion.  After that Kim Jong-il almost immediately sent out his negotiators, indicating that the test was a massive failure, and considering the state of North Korea&#8217;s economy it&#8217;s unlikely he had the capability to improve his program or build more.  Basically, we could have just sat back, kept our mouths shut and let his society collapse on its own.  Now we&#8217;re propping them up with foreign aid because Bush thinks Kim Jong-il might someday be a threat to us.  Utterly ridiculous.</p>
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		<title>By: Chepe Noyon</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41509</link>
		<dc:creator>Chepe Noyon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 04:50:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41509</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Actually, Mr. Bush&#039;s policies have been instrumental in bringing about the long-term decline of the dollar. It has been in a slow, steady freefall for some years now, and that fall is likely to continue now for the foreseeable future. It&#039;s really hard to say just where it will stabilize, but it still has some distance to go before it does stabilize. It will take years of fiscal discipline to clean up the economic mess that Mr. Bush has made.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually, Mr. Bush&#8217;s policies have been instrumental in bringing about the long-term decline of the dollar. It has been in a slow, steady freefall for some years now, and that fall is likely to continue now for the foreseeable future. It&#8217;s really hard to say just where it will stabilize, but it still has some distance to go before it does stabilize. It will take years of fiscal discipline to clean up the economic mess that Mr. Bush has made.</p>
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		<title>By: js290</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41505</link>
		<dc:creator>js290</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2007 04:19:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41505</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[There&#039;s no hypocrisy.  Dubya has been pretty consisent on how he treats countries that threaten the US Dollar&#039;s status as the world&#039;s reserve currency, especially those that have oil.  If you don&#039;t have oil and can&#039;t threaten the US Dollar, he&#039;ll talk to you all day long.

http://forums.greenvilleonline.com/viewtopic.php?p=56008&amp;highlight=#56008]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There&#8217;s no hypocrisy.  Dubya has been pretty consisent on how he treats countries that threaten the US Dollar&#8217;s status as the world&#8217;s reserve currency, especially those that have oil.  If you don&#8217;t have oil and can&#8217;t threaten the US Dollar, he&#8217;ll talk to you all day long.</p>
<p><a href="http://forums.greenvilleonline.com/viewtopic.php?p=56008&#038;highlight=#56008" rel="nofollow">http://forums.greenvilleonline.com/viewtopic.php?p=56008&#038;highlight=#56008</a></p>
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		<title>By: Thomas</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41388</link>
		<dc:creator>Thomas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Oct 2007 17:49:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41388</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I still can&#039;t believe the hypocrisy in the way we treat Iran and North Korea. NK is a totalitarian state led by a nutcase dictator who was self-appointed and will lead for life and most likely appoint his son when he dies. Yet our President is handing over millions of tons of oil to him in exchange for shutting down of nuclear reactors. Then Mr. Bush stands up in front of an audience and has the gall say Iran should be acting more like North Korea? Yet the Bush tactic with Iran seems to be... shut down your reactors OR ELSE! Pure hipocrisy.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I still can&#8217;t believe the hypocrisy in the way we treat Iran and North Korea. NK is a totalitarian state led by a nutcase dictator who was self-appointed and will lead for life and most likely appoint his son when he dies. Yet our President is handing over millions of tons of oil to him in exchange for shutting down of nuclear reactors. Then Mr. Bush stands up in front of an audience and has the gall say Iran should be acting more like North Korea? Yet the Bush tactic with Iran seems to be&#8230; shut down your reactors OR ELSE! Pure hipocrisy.</p>
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		<title>By: js290</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41307</link>
		<dc:creator>js290</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Oct 2007 06:46:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41307</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt;In domestic politics, it’s always a good idea to follow the money.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

That&#039;s right... follow the money... Iran is a terrorist threat to the US Dollar for accepting other currencies for their oil, just like Saddam...

http://furl.net/item.jsp?id=7437761

Remember, War is a Racket...]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>In domestic politics, it’s always a good idea to follow the money.</p></blockquote>
<p>That&#8217;s right&#8230; follow the money&#8230; Iran is a terrorist threat to the US Dollar for accepting other currencies for their oil, just like Saddam&#8230;</p>
<p><a href="http://furl.net/item.jsp?id=7437761" rel="nofollow">http://furl.net/item.jsp?id=7437761</a></p>
<p>Remember, War is a Racket&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: UCrawford</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41248</link>
		<dc:creator>UCrawford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Oct 2007 00:56:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41248</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Jeff,

I just see it as something we can&#039;t do much about at this point.  We can write about it and express our unhappiness, but ultimately Bush doesn&#039;t pay much attention to dissenting viewpoints (particularly on blogs) and he&#039;s going to do whatever he wants to do...same as he generally has since he became president.  He bothers me too, but all we can really do is wait out the storm.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeff,</p>
<p>I just see it as something we can&#8217;t do much about at this point.  We can write about it and express our unhappiness, but ultimately Bush doesn&#8217;t pay much attention to dissenting viewpoints (particularly on blogs) and he&#8217;s going to do whatever he wants to do&#8230;same as he generally has since he became president.  He bothers me too, but all we can really do is wait out the storm.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff Molby</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41244</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff Molby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Oct 2007 00:41:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41244</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Any idea where we&#039;re at in the rotation? I imagine there&#039;s another group scheduled to replace the current one at some point in the next year, right?

I&#039;m just not very comfortable. I don&#039;t want a parliamentary system, but this is one of those times where I would like to vote &quot;no confidence&quot; and be done with it. He was &lt;b&gt;so unbelievably wrong&lt;/b&gt; on the biggest decisions he faced. I just can&#039;t trust him on anything. 15 months is a long f@#$ing time.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Any idea where we&#8217;re at in the rotation? I imagine there&#8217;s another group scheduled to replace the current one at some point in the next year, right?</p>
<p>I&#8217;m just not very comfortable. I don&#8217;t want a parliamentary system, but this is one of those times where I would like to vote &#8220;no confidence&#8221; and be done with it. He was <b>so unbelievably wrong</b> on the biggest decisions he faced. I just can&#8217;t trust him on anything. 15 months is a long f@#$ing time.</p>
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		<title>By: UCrawford</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41234</link>
		<dc:creator>UCrawford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Oct 2007 00:24:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41234</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Doug,

During Iraq our position was not yet solidified in western Afghanistan.  Ismail Khan still controlled Herat, he had the largest army in the country, he didn&#039;t like us and he kept us out of his region.  That changed in 2004 and we now have a sizeable military presence directly on Iran&#039;s eastern border, so we don&#039;t necessarily need three carrier groups.  So if we see a second (or third) carrier group steam into the Persian Gulf it&#039;s probably time to get nervous.  But not until then...I just don&#039;t see it happening at this point unless Bush has just gone completely off the rails mentally.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Doug,</p>
<p>During Iraq our position was not yet solidified in western Afghanistan.  Ismail Khan still controlled Herat, he had the largest army in the country, he didn&#8217;t like us and he kept us out of his region.  That changed in 2004 and we now have a sizeable military presence directly on Iran&#8217;s eastern border, so we don&#8217;t necessarily need three carrier groups.  So if we see a second (or third) carrier group steam into the Persian Gulf it&#8217;s probably time to get nervous.  But not until then&#8230;I just don&#8217;t see it happening at this point unless Bush has just gone completely off the rails mentally.</p>
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		<title>By: UCrawford</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41231</link>
		<dc:creator>UCrawford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Oct 2007 00:17:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41231</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Jeff,

The airbases in Iraq would be problematic because the Iraqi government would certainly be opposed (since most of the leadership has close ties to SCIRI).  Iran would also likely consider it an act of war by Iraq, so it&#039;s not going to happen...same with our airbases in Kuwait, the Kuwaitis don&#039;t want to provoke a war with Iran when they&#039;re so geographically close.  Turkey, Saudi Arabia, and pretty much every other nation in the Gulf would have to grant us flyover rights for us to attack from Europe.  The airbases in Afghanistan and the central Asian republics would be similarly problematic (especially since Afghanistan has trade relations with Iran).  The only way it would be feasible is by carrier group and you&#039;d probably need two to pull it off (because of the probable Iranian counterstrike).  So until the U.S. moves a second carrier group there, it&#039;s probably unlikely that we&#039;ll attack.

There&#039;s always the nuclear first-strike option, of course, but I&#039;d like to think that the Joint Chiefs would threaten to resign if it came to that...and I don&#039;t think Gates would approve either.  He&#039;s from the realist school of foreign relations and he&#039;s never been reported to have a good repoir with Bush, Jr.  Plus, the Soviet Union has already explicitly told the U.S. not to consider a war with Iran.  I think that Bush and Cheney would love to do it, but I don&#039;t think the repercussions are going to allow them to.  So it&#039;s all about watching the carrier groups.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeff,</p>
<p>The airbases in Iraq would be problematic because the Iraqi government would certainly be opposed (since most of the leadership has close ties to SCIRI).  Iran would also likely consider it an act of war by Iraq, so it&#8217;s not going to happen&#8230;same with our airbases in Kuwait, the Kuwaitis don&#8217;t want to provoke a war with Iran when they&#8217;re so geographically close.  Turkey, Saudi Arabia, and pretty much every other nation in the Gulf would have to grant us flyover rights for us to attack from Europe.  The airbases in Afghanistan and the central Asian republics would be similarly problematic (especially since Afghanistan has trade relations with Iran).  The only way it would be feasible is by carrier group and you&#8217;d probably need two to pull it off (because of the probable Iranian counterstrike).  So until the U.S. moves a second carrier group there, it&#8217;s probably unlikely that we&#8217;ll attack.</p>
<p>There&#8217;s always the nuclear first-strike option, of course, but I&#8217;d like to think that the Joint Chiefs would threaten to resign if it came to that&#8230;and I don&#8217;t think Gates would approve either.  He&#8217;s from the realist school of foreign relations and he&#8217;s never been reported to have a good repoir with Bush, Jr.  Plus, the Soviet Union has already explicitly told the U.S. not to consider a war with Iran.  I think that Bush and Cheney would love to do it, but I don&#8217;t think the repercussions are going to allow them to.  So it&#8217;s all about watching the carrier groups.</p>
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		<title>By: Chepe Noyon</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41225</link>
		<dc:creator>Chepe Noyon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Oct 2007 00:05:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41225</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Jeff, I admit that Bush is just stupid enough to try an attack on Iran. There&#039;s no way we could pull off an invasion, so it would be some limited set of airstrikes. The problem is that even airstrikes have to be done carefully, where first you go in an take out the air force, then the missile defenses and the radars, and so forth. By the time we could start taking out infrastructure they would have had plenty of time to harden everything with simple AA guns, which are pretty difficult to take out. It would be long and bloody and wouldn&#039;t in the end make much of a dent. Maybe Bush is dumb enough to try, but I would hope that our military would set him straight.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeff, I admit that Bush is just stupid enough to try an attack on Iran. There&#8217;s no way we could pull off an invasion, so it would be some limited set of airstrikes. The problem is that even airstrikes have to be done carefully, where first you go in an take out the air force, then the missile defenses and the radars, and so forth. By the time we could start taking out infrastructure they would have had plenty of time to harden everything with simple AA guns, which are pretty difficult to take out. It would be long and bloody and wouldn&#8217;t in the end make much of a dent. Maybe Bush is dumb enough to try, but I would hope that our military would set him straight.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff Molby</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41201</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff Molby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Oct 2007 22:00:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41201</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Are the airbases in Iraq useful for launching attacks or are they primarily freight and short-range patrols?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Are the airbases in Iraq useful for launching attacks or are they primarily freight and short-range patrols?</p>
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		<title>By: Doug Mataconis</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41200</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug Mataconis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Oct 2007 21:53:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41200</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Crawford, 

Even two carrier groups is probably just a threat, not evidence of an attack.

During Iraq and Afghanistan there were at least three, and I think at one point for, carrier battle groups within striking range.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Crawford, </p>
<p>Even two carrier groups is probably just a threat, not evidence of an attack.</p>
<p>During Iraq and Afghanistan there were at least three, and I think at one point for, carrier battle groups within striking range.</p>
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		<title>By: UCrawford</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41198</link>
		<dc:creator>UCrawford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Oct 2007 21:50:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/10/22/iran-rhetoric-and-reality/#comment-41198</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[We&#039;ve got one carrier group sitting in the Gulf.  Until Bush moves another in then the author Doug cited is correct, an attack is probably not imminent.  However, a carrier group can be deployed to the Gulf relatively quickly and air support is available from other sources so that&#039;s not to say it couldn&#039;t happen...it&#039;s just not a certainty at this point.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We&#8217;ve got one carrier group sitting in the Gulf.  Until Bush moves another in then the author Doug cited is correct, an attack is probably not imminent.  However, a carrier group can be deployed to the Gulf relatively quickly and air support is available from other sources so that&#8217;s not to say it couldn&#8217;t happen&#8230;it&#8217;s just not a certainty at this point.</p>
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