Ron Paul Makes Thanksgiving Eve Appearance With Alex Jones

For some more pandering to the Troofers and other conspiracy theorist whackjobs. I’ll listen for anything of note, but as of now, I’m done with Ron Paul.

The Ron Paul campaign has unfortunately become a gathering place for 9/11 “Truther” morons, racists, neo-Nazis, Southern secessionists, fascists, conspiracy theorists, wannabe authoritarians, Birchers, and nativists that I do not want to be associated with. Worst of all, the candidate himself knows about these err….outside of the mainstream supporters and he refuses to publically repudiate them and refund the donations from the most high profile ones. (No Lew, I’m not calling for Ron Paul to do background checks on all of his supporters, just refuse the donations from the high profile scumbags). If a candidate thinks its alright to make common cause with these people, especially one who is running a “principled” campaign on restoring liberty, than I have to question his conscience for aligning with these people at best and question his ability to lead at worst. I’ve come to the conclusion that a Ron Paul candidacy unless he repudiates these people who do not share the belief in liberty, will harm the overall freedom movement by giving the impression to the American people that “freedom” and “liberty” are just code words for fascism, racism, and conspiracy mongering like the “New World Order” and the “North American Union”.

The precedent is there. Ron Paul needs to follow it for entire freedom movement’s sake.

Until then, this classical liberal is not a part of the Ron Paul Revolution.

h/t: My Pet Jawa

I’m one of the original co-founders of The Liberty Papers all the way back in 2005. Since then, I wound up doing this blogging thing professionally. Now I’m running the site now. You can find my other work at IJ Review.com and Rare. You can also find me over at the R Street Institute.
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  • Lost_In_Translation

    These people hate the government. Ron’s anti government. He hasn’t said a word otherwise to suggest he’s making common cause with them. I really hope the noise gets loud enough so they get lost in it, but I don’t feel its Paul’s or anyone on his campaign’s job to start spiting in these idiots faces. Obviously we disagree, but I think this is just politicing as usual and you can either play the game or not. I doubt it costs Paul much of anything to ignore it and if it gets to the point where this matters most about the campaign, obviously his message has failed and the American people can be stuck with mediocicy for atleast another 4-40 years.

  • Brent

    While you’re at it, don’t read any more books by Judge Andrew Napolitano, or columns from Pat Buchanan, nor the MIT linguistics professor Noam Chomsky. Don’t listen to Duran Duran (as Warren Cuccurullo went on), nor elect Cynthia McKinney – she was a congresswoman in Georgia, nor listen to the UN weapons inspector in Iraq Scott Ritter.

    Oh, and don’t listen to KLBJ News Radio in Texas, nor National Public Radio.

    You’re kidding me right? Because Ron Paul went on this radio station, it automatically discredits him? Everything he says doesn’t mean anything, anymore? You were never a real supporter, you are just trying to get attention.

  • Klutometis

    “[E]specially one who is running a ‘principled’ campaign on restoring liberty . . .”

    Sorry, Soviet shill; liberty means tolerating viewpoints that are offensive to you.

    Anything less is Bolshevik micro-tyranny.

  • Peggy

    That rant you got there was pretty darn “kooky” in itself. Would you like some cheese with that whine?

    What the hell scares you about “troofers”?! You know they are wrong. Hell, let them have an investigation to prove that they are morons and shut them the hell up!!

    Why waste time name calling like a little school girl? It really sounds quite rediculous.

  • http://thelibertypapers.org/2005/11/22/a-bit-about-kevin/ Kevin

    Obviously we disagree, but I think this is just politicing as usual and you can either play the game or not.

    Bill Clinton repudiated Sister Soljah. George H.W. Bush repudiated David Duke. Pat Buchanan repudiated the white nationalists every time they backed him for his presidential runs. Why can’t Ron Paul?

    I doubt it costs Paul much of anything to ignore it and if it gets to the point where this matters most about the campaign, obviously his message has failed and the American people can be stuck with mediocicy for atleast another 4-40 years.

    America has survived worse things than Ron Paul losing the Republican nomination.

  • D.L. Mitchell

    So you are going to take your ball and go home because you don’t like some of the players. Your call, I guess. But what are you going to do on primary day? Vote Giuliani because some 9-11 conspiracy guy is voting for Paul? Doesn’t make much sense to me.

  • gmason08

    -Rants, Check

    -Storms off, Check

    -Repeats of the above forthcoming, Likely

  • Curtis

    I really hate to tell ya this but you won’t be done with Ron Paul until, at the earliest, January 2013. You are, however, entitled to ignore or cover the events in whichever way you choose. I think once he is in office for a year or two that your fears will subside.

  • http://thelibertypapers.org/2005/11/22/a-bit-about-kevin/ Kevin

    Brent,

    Reading comprehension is a good thing. Learn it. None of those people are running for president.

    Klutometis,

    I’m not advocating the censorship of the kooks supporting Ron Paul, I’m choosing not to associate with them. Free speech means you have the right to say what you want. I do not have to provide you with a platform or associate with you if I don’t want to. I’m merely urging Ron Paul to choose not to associate with these kooks.

    Peggy,

    Because there already have been numerous public and private investigations and overwhelming evidence that 9/11 was exactly what the government said it was, an attack by Al-Qaeda hijackers. The thought that the American government would either allow the mass murder of 3,000 Americans to occur or take part in it is revolting.

  • Hey You!

    You are an idiot pal…we do not need you.

  • Hey You!

    BTW The NAU is real and you will find that out shortly, you are a misguided tool.

  • js290

    The know-it-all student from the directional Louisiana has convinced me not to vote for Ron Paul…

    http://tinyurl.com/2xwm2b

  • http://thelibertypapers.org/2005/11/22/a-bit-about-kevin/ Kevin

    D.L Mitchell,

    Who said I was voting for Giuliani? I’m probably not going to vote in the Republican primary.

    “Hey You!”

    You are an idiot pal…we do not need you.

    Okay.

  • B.

    From “Paultards” to Retards..Time to wake up..!!

  • Hugh G. Knutts

    Kevin, it’s nice to see someone using common sense and placing core values above popularity.

    Paul typically holds 2-5% in most polls I’ve seen. Take away the neo-nazis, truther types, white supremacist groups, anarchists, anti-semites and other undesirable groups, and how much of that 5% national support would Paul have?

    There is a reason these types of people are flocking to him. Any candidate that can amass these types of people in such great numbers deserves a second, third and fourth look.

    This isn’t the first time he’s pandered to the alex jones nuts. If my candidate appeared on alex jones’s show, I’d have some serious concerns. If he appeared four times in a year, and his primary base was the most despicable of Americans, he’d no longer be my candidate.

    Kudos for taking a moral position.

  • Maria

    I heard about Alex Jones. I am not associated with him. I am not associated with those groups you cite (Neo-nazis, racist, etc).. AT ALL. But I don’t like the way you sound.. Why are these people guilty? You sound so informed, but are not giving out basic info..Have they been found guilty/innocent regarding some unspoken crimes? So, please, tell me… Are you judging attitudes, opinions, feelings, instead of actions? I must be pretty stupid cause I dont understand how come you learned they “do not share the belief in liberty”. What is that belief you talk about? How do you know?

    As I see it, they all have the right to donate to any campaign, and the right to voice their different opinions. Who are you (us) to take away that right away from them?

    My education and intelligence are very limited; yet, I can sense you never liked RP as you say.

    By the way, I am also the member of two different minorities (female and Cuban), and Ron Paul ideas fill my heart with joy and hope. I left my country to escape Castro and enjoy American freedoms. But the things happening here now bring me very BAD MEMORIES of my terrible childhood in Cuba….you call them FLASHBACKS?

    I hate to see what is happening to this wonderful country now.. Americans should fight to retain/recover all their liberties!

    I know the face of hunger and scarcity. But the face of opression is the ugliest one. I dont want any American child to grow up as I did.

    My vote for Ron Paul, and the votes of my family and friendsd for him too.

  • http://thelibertypapers.org/2005/11/22/a-bit-about-kevin/ Kevin

    gmason08,

    Still here.

    Curtis,

    I’m more likely than Ron Paul to become president in 2008.

  • http://thelibertypapers.org/2005/11/22/a-bit-about-kevin/ Kevin

    Maria,

    As I see it, they all have the right to donate to any campaign, and the right to voice their different opinions. Who are you (us) to take away that right away from them?

    I’m not taking away their right to voice their despicable opinions, I’m choosing not to associate with them and I’m choosing not to associate with a candidate who will not repudiate these people. Free speech only gives you the right to express your opinions, I do not have to give you a platform to express nor associate with you.

  • D.L. Mitchell

    Kevin,

    No one said you are voting for Giuliani. I just mentioned Giuliani because he is someone other than Paul. I can rephrase the question if you like: are you really going to let the vote of some 9-11 conspiracy guy dissuade you from voting for Paul, if Paul is your true vote? Doesn’t make much sense to me.

    Personally I hope every crank, militia man, white supremacist, and conspiracy nut in America donates to the campaign and casts a vote for Ron Paul. After the election we can all go back to ignoring each other.

  • http://thelibertypapers.org/2005/11/22/a-bit-about-kevin/ Kevin

    js290,

    Your attack on my age and my university aside, a statement from a campaign spokesmouth means absolutely nothing. Spokesmouths lie all the time for candidates. It also shows me that Ron Paul is afraid to repudiate these people himself and he has to hide behind his spokesmouth. Imagine how he’ll handle a hostile foreign leader….

  • Brent

    Kevin,

    So, you can support people who are on the show, but if they are running for president, you can’t support them anymore. If they are public servants, like MPs or congresspeople or ambassadors, it’s still okay. BUT, if they’re running for president, the candidates’ positions don’t mean anything anymore. He’s discredited as pandering to conspiracy theorist, he’s a cook.

    Kevin, there is a flaw in this ideology. Why is it okay to support one person who was on the show, but not another, simply because of their job title or political positions?

    I could understand that you don’t think it’s a good idea, but to pull away your support and vote, it doesn’t make sense.

  • B.

    RONPAUL2008.COM Donate Now…..

  • Brent

    Kevin,

    Now I see you attacking his campaign. You’re obviously not a supporter, nor have you ever been judging from your attitude towards him.

  • Renny

    Ha-ha-ha! You are a MORON! I guess you just don’t realize how bad of shape this country/world really is. Donkey.

  • Steve

    Thats right, just like the old saying, “cut your nose off to spite your face”. No other canidate wants to restore freedom, but because there are a very few wackos that support Ron Paul you are going to “throw the baby out with the bath water”

    Not very clever.

  • http://thelibertypapers.org/2005/11/22/a-bit-about-kevin/ Kevin

    D.L. Mitchell,

    I can rephrase the question if you like: are you really going to let the vote of some 9-11 conspiracy guy dissuade you from voting for Paul, if Paul is your true vote?

    If some idiot Truther or some idiot Nazi or some other idiots want to vote for Ron Paul, I don’t have a problem with it. I have a problem with it when Ron Paul takes money from them, doesn’t repudiate them, goes on their radio talk shows and panders to them, and otherwise actively solicits their vote. I will not be associated with a candidate who cannot understand that or is too cowardly to repudiate these people.

  • http://publiusendures.blogspot.com Mark

    For the record- as someone who watched the Pentagon burn, and heard the Pentagon plane flying over my apartment less than a mile from the crash site- any deliberate attempt to court support from those who deny what happened that day is personally insulting to me.
    What make this worse is that it shows Paul’s priorities- he would rather spend time chasing the votes and support of a tiny number of 9/11 Truthers than chasing the votes and support of the millions of libertarians, disillusioned Republicans, and disillusioned Democrats. It’s simple math, really: he has limited resources. Why spend those limited resources on a small group of whack-jobs than on a large group of people who have been hungry for a politician speaking the language of freedom ever since Reagan left office?

  • http://truthseeds.org Truthseeds

    He’s a uniter, not a divider. Why would any candidate want to take on that kind of attitude towards their supporters. Shallow and ignorant approach.

  • Pingback: Publius Endures()

  • http://www.republicofmiami.com Ricky

    Nice to see a fellow cuban-american for ron paul!

    your logic is ridiculous…
    I guess you will never vote again in your life…
    You can say every candidate has some sort of groups associated with them you probably wont like…you were never a true ron paul supporter…

    The Internet is Ron Paul Territory
    RON PAUL 2008 – a candidate that doesnt judge people – you should learn from him

  • http://thelibertypapers.org/2005/11/22/a-bit-about-kevin/ Kevin

    Brent,

    I have bought Andrew Napolitiano’s books before. I have recommended them to friends. Honestly, I’m not aware that he as appeared on the Alex Jones show until tonight. He is not running for office, Ron Paul is. I understand the difference between selling books and running for office. Ron Paul has chosen to campaign for the votes of Truthers, white supremacists, milita nuts, and other people I refuse to be associated with. As for the other people on the list, I never liked them anyway.

  • Lost_In_Translation

    Bill Clinton repudiated Sister Soljah. George H.W. Bush repudiated David Duke. Pat Buchanan repudiated the white nationalists every time they backed him for his presidential runs. Why can’t Ron Paul?

    I know nothing about any of that, but I do not believe Ron Paul secretly approves of truthers, white supremicists, alien conspiracy nuts, etc. Maybe you think that, but I don’t, so I really don’t care what Paul doesn’t say about them. You may be correct that this will hurt him, but if you really like his positions are and believe he is honest in those positions, you can’t stand up and tell me that you refuse to vote for him because he hasn’t said the right words to everybody else.

    I believe its called sheep mentality. You really don’t want to like Paul before you have someone around you assure you its OK to like Paul and by Paul doing what you say, you think atleast people around you will accept that you support him. If enough people support Paul, you might come around, because then it will feel good to support Paul, you won’t be alone, you won’t have people saying mean things to you, you won’t feel bad if your candidate doesn’t win.

    Or, if you you really don’t believe in Paul’s message, you’re trying to pawn it off on one of the few things you can find fault with so you don’t have to argue the real difference.

    It really doesn’t matter which you are, because either way you’re hiding other reasons and trying to convince everone and yourself that there is one logical reason you can’t pull the trigger, you can’t commit.

    Just remember, its easy to join a revolution when its already won, but its more worthwhile to create one yourself.

  • Brent

    Kevin,

    I think it is you who is the coward. It takes a brave man to keep the donations. Giving money back only opens a Pandora box. I’m going to guess that more people have donated to other campaigns that are much worse. Rapist, wife beaters, but no one cares, because no one knows who they are. But if a man is racist and popular, we must give back his money! My my, you don’t make much sense.

    Mark & Publius Endures,

    I find it insulting that you guys find it okay that Ron Paul goes on Fox, a network which advocates, wars, death, and acts of violence on citizens, but you find horribly wrong that he goes on a radio talk show in Texas where the host thinks 9/11 is an inside job.

    Are you kidding me? A mans word is more powerfully insulting than another’s propaganda of war, death, and violence? It doesn’t make sense to me, it really doesn’t.

  • http://www.thecrossedpond.com Brad

    What’s so offensive about 9-11 truthers?

    They believe in something kooky and without evidence.

    So?

    Is there something innately above-the-pale about conspiracy theories? Who gives a shit, honestly?

  • Charles S.

    Hey, I support the 9/11 truth movement, and I have also donated to the Paul campaign. Is my status as an individual your reason for not supporting Mr. Paul? Why are your convictions so weak as to flip flop around so?

    Who then, do you support? I’m sorry, but if Ron doesn’t have a chance, Gravel or Kucinich certainly have NO chance.

    At the end of the day, you will have detracted from the only cause which had a shot at making a difference. Good for you.

  • Brent

    Kevin,

    Ron Paul is running for office.

    He goes on a talk show in Texas while he is at his home for the weekend.

    Why does Ron Paul go on such a show though?

    Well, they don’t like the Patriot Act, the Military Commissions Act, the war in Iraq, big government, government regulations, the Federal Reserve, etc.

    Well my my, it just so happens that Ron Paul doesn’t either! So he goes on the radio show, he talks about his view point as a Congressman, his disgust of the current broken system we have.

    But no, Ron Paul should NEVER talk to THOSE people, because THOSE people, those people listening to him in Texas and on the interwebs, THOSE people are EVIL! They think 9/11 was an INSIDE JOB! TO HELL WITH THEM!

    But yet, you grant the right for him to go on a television network that supports the war, supports the federal reserve, cares less about the Patriot and Military Commissions Act, want more government regulation. It’s okay that they support a war that kills thousands of people, it’s okay that they lie about the facts to push their own agenda, it’s okay! They are on TV!

    I just find it contradictory that he can be on one media outlet and not agree with them, but he can’t be on another because they are “kooks” and they believe in something else that less people believe in!

    It doesn’t matter that they don’t harm people, that they don’t spread hates, it’s because of the very nature of their freedom of speech. They believe in something different, and for that, they should be ignored.

    It just doesn’t make sense, very double-standards. If Ron was to only go on a talk show, and the host had to be 100% on Paul’s political positions, he wouldn’t be on talk shows at all, or any media outlet for that matter.

  • Li

    I’m latino, yet I don’t think I would be comfortable if Paul DID send back the money. Nor would I be happy if Paul picked and choosed which shows to be on. Paul has specifically stated several times that he doesn’t not believe 9/11 was an inside job, and further that he doesn’t believe the government is even capable of pulling it off without leaks or problems. He has stated this to truthers themselves, directly, and to seperate questioners.

    Now, should Paul refuse to have discourse with them? Should he put his fingers in his ears and shout? Should he censor certain groups, donations, and ideas? I say no, and as I mentioned I would even be uncomfortable with Paul if he did. If and when I should ever run for office anyone will be welcome to spend me a check, whether I agree with them or not. Should Republicans refuse checks from Democrats? Should they refuse money from Libertarians? From former convicts? Where do we draw the line? Paul’s whole point is that he WON’T draw that line; if it is a legal donation he then he is fine with it and won’t waste his time in self-righteous political manoeuvering. I think he is standing on much firmer moral ground then you are with your self-righteous disdain and demands.

    I have a proposition for you. How about you not buy into the guilt-by-association rhetoric? How about you not play political games? How about you recognize that Paul himself does not believe 9/11 was an inside job, that he is not racist, but that do to his freedom ideology he will not attack those who are? I suspect you don’t actually believe Paul supports any of that crap. And considering he’s directly said several times that racists are wasting their money and truthers are wrong, it’s hard to even call it “pandering”. If I pop onto O’Reilly and tell him the war is wrong, does that make a warhawk just for appearing on his show? Apparently.

    Most of those who distance themselves from this group or that group do it only for political gain. I have seen many politicians speak up for latino rights or attack those who are holding us down, all for purely political reasons. “Pandering”, as you put it. Paul truly believes in freedom and equality for all. That integrity of mesasage and authenticity of character means more to me then your self-righteous rant ever will. How about you become part of something real and stop worrying about image, political maneouvering, and petty attacks?

    The man has received tens of thousands from the military, millions from everyday people, and a few hundred bucks from some racist I’ve never heard of. Yet you focus on the racist. By giving all the airtime to the racist and taking it away from the military or Paul’s support among minorities, I think you missed the real story. The ironic part is people then wonder why all politicans pander, why politicians play games of political manoeuvering and obfuscate their message. It’s because of people like you. Paul isn’t like that, and one of the ramifications is he won’t stress your gripe about appearences. As an American citizen I’m fine with that, and you should be too.

  • D.L. Mitchell

    Kevin,

    If some idiot Truther or some idiot Nazi or some other idiots want to vote for Ron Paul, I don’t have a problem with it. I have a problem with it when Ron Paul takes money from them, doesn’t repudiate them, goes on their radio talk shows and panders to them, and otherwise actively solicits their vote. I will not be associated with a candidate who cannot understand that or is too cowardly to repudiate these people.

    You will vote for him but you won’t be “associated” with him, is that it? What could be more of an association than voting to place him in the presidency?

    And I reject your claim that Paul is actively soliciting the votes of any of the groups you mention. He is certainly not soliciting the votes of white supremacists, and he has publicly rejected the claims of 9-11 conspiracists on several occasions. The bottom line is that Paul does not “inherit” the views of the people who support him; he is his own man.

  • http://publiusendures.blogspot.com Mark

    Brent- You don’t get it. It has nothing to do with Alex Jones. It has to do with the people who listen to Alex Jones. It has to do with the fact that Paul has decided his LIMITED resources are best spent pursuing the votes of a tiny subsection of complete idiots rather than pursuing the votes of the millions of disillusioned libertarians, Republicans, etc. If he went on Fox News or any other MSM outlet, he would be speaking to tens of millions of Americans who may or may not agree with the hosts. By going on to Alex Jones’ show- which is syndicated and not just broadcast locally in Texas- he is pursuing the votes of a few hundred thousand individuals who are listening to Jones because they agree with him.

    I have no problem with him accepting the support of these peope. But he already has it! Continuing to seek their support means that he doesn’t view them merely as “fellow travelers,” but as an essential part of his campaign. A few hundred thousand of them, but millions of us- yet he has chosen them. Forgive me for being demoralized. The Ron Paul 08 sticker is coming off the car tonight.

  • Tek Gremlin

    Although I disagree with the views of the Truthers etc, I think in America everyone has the right to freedom of speech and FULL inclusion in the political process (I guess so does Ron Paul). Censoring a campaigns supporters removes the donators right to the process (in this case a donation is a form of expression).

    I am glad Ron Paul cares enough about these peoples freedoms to not refuse there money, that way I am sure as President he will care about mine.

    Freedom has a down side, live with it, or choose Slavery, your call.

  • Brent

    Mark,

    You still don’t get it, you still do not get it. It’s very sad indeed.

    Ron Paul was at home, he was not in NYC or LA. He was at home and he was talking to someone on the phone.

    You seem to think if Ron Paul wasn’t on this show, he would magically appear on CNN and Fox all these great shows that have millions (overstatement I’d say) of people watching him! Oh me, oh my! What a wonderful world it would be to clap your hands and end up with million of people listening to you!

    But it’s Turkey-eve, and everyone is going home, including Ron Paul, and he decided to call a guy named Alex Jones as he was at home. And you aren’t supporting him, because of that.

  • LP4RP

    What I find most amusing about these posts (the original articles) is that they come from sites or people who claim to be “defending individual freedom and liberty, one post at a time.” This writer is not defending RP’s freedom to associate with people who have views different from his own. No, RP should only associate with people who agree with the author because other viewpoints are irrational and invalid. He should publicly denounce everyone, especially groups, that he disagrees with, else he is promoting facism and racism under the guise of freedom and liberty. I honestly don’t see the connection. I guess that’s what makes you a “classic liberal,” a term which I’ve never associated myself with.

  • Jonathan

    What is up with all the truther hatred. Is there no room for a rational person to have questions they feel aren’t answered. The itimation that truthers are somehow lumped in with hate groups is also not pleasant as someone who has serious doubts about the offical theory.

  • Tess

    Mr. Liberty writing this article, I will tell you, are what is wrong with America. You need to get your head out of the sand or out of the cave, think you been hanging out with Bin Laden Dude. One thing I have learned in my years is you do not make allies by trying to tear them down or downgrading them. You, dear Sir are very wrong, and I now have you and your silly paper on my boycott list. What a closed mind you have.

    Ron Paul has my vote and support. Let Freedom Ring!!!

  • http://publiusendures.blogspot.com Mark

    Brent:
    This isn’t one isolated incident. This is one of many. Yesterday, I thought that his campaign had finally decided to take a stand and turn a new leaf with the letter to NRO. To follow that up by, within 36 hours, doing exactly what he said he was not doing was a last straw.

    Have you ever even listened to the Alex Jones show? I’ve now listened to it for over an hour. This is not some local radio show- it’s a nationally syndicated show that has no purpose other than to advance conspiracy theories about the New World Order, the Bilderbergers, etc. If he had only appeared on the show once or twice, fine, or only about specific issues having nothing to do with conspiracy whack-jobbery, fine. But that’s not the case. He has regularly appeared on this show over the years; he has gotten burned for it on a number of occasions. He has gotten burned by it even worse in recent days. Yet tonight he returns again.

    What he doesn’t seem to realize is that his campaign has gotten so big now that much of the public as a whole views him as the be all and end all of libertarianism. Indeed, thanks to the cult of personality that has sprung up around him, much of the general public views him as the very definition of libertarianism.

    As a result, when he appears on shows like this, he is no longer just representing himself or his campaign. He is representing me and all libertarians. But no longer- not in my name! Ron Paul is an individualist, and I respect that- but so am I.

  • DF Robichaux

    You are too young to remember, but folks you find abhorrent supported Ronald Reagan and most likely Barry Goldwater before him, although I was too young to know. Those folks are a legacy of the American west with values of self-reliance and skepticism of government which are anathema to our socialist establishment. Reagan and Goldwater were denounced as kooks and slimed by socialist the same way as Paul is. When you look at the Republican field of candidates, the only candidate who has any chance and is not a socialist is Ron Paul. Although Thompson is closer to the libertarian side of the spectrum, he would extend the socialist ideal of foreign interventionism. Every other candidate either Republican or Democratic advocates both domestic and foreign interventionism by the federal government and thusly can be classified as a socialist.
    If you consider yourself libertarian, you should become better acquainted with history. A good place to start for preeminent libertarian thought would be lewrockwell.com and Taki’s Top Drawer.

    Regards
    DF Robichaux
    Fellow South Louisiana resident
    http://lifebelowi10.blogspot.com/

  • Mike

    What a dunce! Not supporting Ron Paul because 911 Truthers are behind him? If we start talking like that we’ll sound like a bunch of Democrats that require their people to fit the politically correct, party-sanctioned mold! Are we for Liberty, or aren’t we?

    I say everyone, EVERYONE, that’s distrustful and skeptical of Big Government should be welcome to join in on this phenomenon!!

    GO RON PAUL! I hate to admit it but I voted for Bush in 2000 and 2004. I WILL NOT vote for another establishment Republican hack. If Paul doesn’t get the nomination, I’M GOING TO WRITE HIM IN!

  • Brent

    Mark,

    I can understand you not wanting him to go on such shows because as an individual yourself you don’t condone such things and believe it is harmful to the campaign.

    But what I don’t understand is, why would you not vote for him anymore? Has his views changed? Would his policies change? This is the part where I am confused. You don’t like his appearances on those shows, respectfully, but you don’t vote for him simply because of that?

    The problem I have with such an agrument is that, there is so much more problems than “he’ll represent libertarianism badly!” America will self-destruct and no one else is running willing to defuse it. You don’t support him because of this, so it seems to me that you really don’t know or care about the future of this country, just the future of libertarianism.

    If you like his positions, if you like what he’d do in office, vote for him. But don’t withdraw support simply because he’s on Alex Jones.

  • http://publiusendures.blogspot.com Mark

    Tess:
    So the LewRockwell.com assault on David Bernstein for making a calm and rational criticism- AS A SIDE NOTE- of Paul was not “tearing down”? The accusation by so many Paul supporters that just about anyone who disagrees with Paul on something is a “fascist” isn’t “degrading”? That is the problem that has arisen within the Ron Paul grassroots- any criticism of them whatsoever (no matter how mild) is immediately attacked as irrational, hateful, “neoconservative”, and all sorts of other ad hominems.

    I have no problem with rational inquiry and questioning. I do, however, have a problem with people who weren’t there on 9/11 telling me that I didn’t see and hear what I saw and heard. I have a problem with people who claim that everything that doesn’t fit their worldview is a “conspiracy” against them, rather than inquiring into why things went against them in the first place.

    I’m sorry- but I have put a lot of my own credibility on the line these last few months trying to defend Ron Paul from all sorts of attacks. I have generally done so rationally; as a result, I have changed the minds of many people who thought all Ron Paul supporters were lunatics. I have even made converts. Unlike so many others, I have not gotten banned from sites, but instead have been invited back. I’ve even written guidelines for Ron Paul supporters in order for them to be effective and persuasive rather than just get themselves kicked off and ignored.

    So to watch Paul singlehandedly destroy so many of the defenses I made of him….well, let’s just say I feel a little bit deceived and betrayed. Don’t get me wrong- Paul is too important to the libertarian movement right now for me to give up on him permanently. But until he has his “Sista Souljah” moment, I’m going to do my best not to put my credibility on the line for him.

  • O’Shaughnessy

    Calm yerself, calm yerself about the neo-nazi wackos who obviously misunderstand Ron Paul’s (rhymes with John Paul) platform. The Irish take on this is: “Thank God he held onto their money…it’s been in the devil’s hands long enough!”

    To give it back is downright immoral because he would in effect be subsidizing their cause. A campaign donation is not a contract, it is a lottery ticket. The wackos are too stupid to realize they lost the prize the second they gave him the loot.

    Ron Paul should be canonized for having the courage to steal the money from the devil’s minions.

    Politicians who return cash to the devil show what deceptive snakes they really are!

  • gmason08

    Mark says-
    “He is representing me and all libertarians”

    followed by

    “Ron Paul is an individualist, and I respect that- but so am I.”

    Huh? Do those two statements jibe to you Mark? You are an “individualist” but you are offended by the way the individualist, Ron Paul, represents some written in stone dogma of a (collectivist?) group you think are called “libertarians”.

    I am an individual, having individual views. I see libertarianism as promoting a concept of freedom and liberty. An important part of freedom and liberty is allowing and championing the right of all to have their individual views, free of coercive groupthink/majority peer pressure. Is there an approved/mandated “libertarian” position on all matters debateable? I did not receive that memo. Was it titled “Want to be a Liberty Loving Libertarian-Read Below to Learn What WE Must FREELY and UNIFORMLY Think about ANYTHING and EVERYTHING”?

  • http://www.cheeksmalloy.com/ Illya Harrell

    All this talk about Alex Jones, 9-11 truthers, neo-nazis leaves me shaking my head.

    Can anyone answer this?

    Why has Ron Paul received more military contributions than the rest of the GOP candidates combined?

    Are you anti-Ron Paul people going to start lumping our brave soldiers in with the fringe contributors?

    Anyone?

  • js290

    They believe in something kooky and without evidence.

    Iraq and WMDs…

  • Bo

    I guess when you can’t take a man down on his record you look for anything to stop him.

    Ron Paul is the only honest candidate running for president that will end the runaway debt and the devaluing dollar. Yes freedom and liberty are worth fighting for. Fight on Dr. Paul. Stop the madness of Washington corporate lobyists that took the government from the people.

  • http://publiusendures.blogspot.com Mark

    Brent:
    Your questions are fair and legitimate.

    My response is this, though: if the Paul campaign is going to continue to spend resources recruiting this small segment of the population, it will have no chance at victory, so the type of President Paul would have been becomes irrelevant- you simply cannot win an election if your campaign strategy is to focus on a tiny minority of people. Meanwhile, however, recruiting this section of the population results in the majority of the population associating this small group with not only Ron Paul, but also libertarianism more generally. So the effect of this is two-fold: it decreases the campaign’s likelihood of victory, while also engraining the connection between libertarianism and conspiracy theorists. If that is the case, then libertarians will have no choice but to distance themselves as much as possible from the Paul campaign, or risk the likelihood that libertarianism will lose much of its appeal at the very time when it had the most opportunity to make a difference.

    If, however, the Paul campaign vocally renounces any connection with the white supremacists and the 9/11 conspiracy theorists and focuses on recruiting libertarians and disillusioned Republicans….well, he then has an actual chance at getting the nomination or mounting a meaningful third party candidacy. Not only that, but he will be the best thing that has happened to libertarianism since Atlas Shrugged. Unfortunately, his actions tonight suggest that he has chosen the former approach.

  • three lips

    ron paul’s neutral approach to donations is a testament to his definition of freedom. it’s not his job to decide or confirm what is socially acceptable. his job is to protect your right to arrive at your own conclusions. he doesn’t pander to any particular groups or factions, and the crowds at his rallies reflect this.

    smart college kids constitute a bigger percentage of his fanbase than any of the fringe groups that keep coming up in this discussion.

    and about 9/11 “truthers”: why does it matter if they support ron paul? people who question 9/11 are the same people who distrust big government. naturally, ron paul is the candidate that best fits them.

  • Jordan

    Hey bro you are exactly right. Why should Ron Paul talk to anyone who doesnt think steel buildings miraculously melt and collapse at free fall speed from jet fuel. And I agree with you that Ron Paul shoud stay away from people who dont think that 19 terrorists trained in the US could highjack 4 planes with boxcutters and then fly them with precision although they had limited and poor flight training. Right on bro. I think Ron Paul should stay clear of anyone who might think that Tower 7 didnt just magically melt like the other two towers, although of course it was not hit by a plane and had very small fires in it. I just wanted to write to you and say that you are really intelligent and by the way, I agree with you, even though the Bush administration is the most corrupt weve ever had and lied us into war – We should just listen to the official 9/11 story and never ask questions. All I have to say is anyone who wants a new investigation into some of the unanswered questions on 9/11 (like most of the victims families) should be treated like an outcast and an American hater. Right on bro. Lets all just worship Rudy Julie-Annie the 9/11 criminal. Lets worship the 9/11 commission report like it was the bible. I say, if Ron Paul speaks again to anyone who is trying to think for themselves then he should be forced to drop out of the race. I wish the country had more people like you. Then we would all be so happy and ignorant. Question your government dude.

  • js290

    I’m choosing not to associate with a candidate who will not repudiate these people.

    We can always throw them in Gitmo…

  • DJ

    Instead of just moaning about it on obscure blogs, why not also write to the campaign make sure they know you’re upset about the matter? Surely if enough people tell them “I won’t vote for you unless you do x” then they might start to listen. And if they don’t listen, you have your answer… but moaning about it in the comments section of blog posts that few people read is guaranteed to achieve nothing.

  • http://www.thecrossedpond.com Brad

    Brent- You don’t get it. It has nothing to do with Alex Jones. It has to do with the people who listen to Alex Jones. It has to do with the fact that Paul has decided his LIMITED resources are best spent pursuing the votes of a tiny subsection of complete idiots rather than pursuing the votes of the millions of disillusioned libertarians, Republicans, etc. If he went on Fox News or any other MSM outlet, he would be speaking to tens of millions of Americans who may or may not agree with the hosts. By going on to Alex Jones’ show- which is syndicated and not just broadcast locally in Texas- he is pursuing the votes of a few hundred thousand individuals who are listening to Jones because they agree with him.

    Wait, so you’re not supporting him not based on being offended by who he associates with, but rather based on being offended by who the people he associates with associate with?

    In any case, who cares who supports him? What are you joining a club?

    Vote for ideas, and a candidate. I’m not sure why all this peripheral crap would be a dealbreaker for anybody.

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  • TonyBologna

    “but as of now, I’m done with Ron Paul”

    Thank god, it’s about time. Now let’s see how long you can actually make good on that statement?!

  • http://www.orderhotlunch.com Jeff Molby

    Vote for ideas, and a candidate. I’m not sure why all this peripheral crap would be a dealbreaker for anybody.

    Amen. How the heck did this conversation on this site devolve to the point that that needed to be said??

    If you don’t think Paul is the best candidate, don’t vote for him.

    All of this other crap is just armchair-quarterbacking the campaign strategy. You may be right and you may be wrong, but it doesn’t matter at all what you think right now. The coach called the play and he’s not going to change it because the third-string Center disagrees with him. Time will tell who is right and we’ll make sure to review the game film thoroughly when it’s over.

    Once more, for good measure:

    Vote for ideas, and a candidate. I’m not sure why all this peripheral crap would be a dealbreaker for anybody.

  • recordman

    why doesn’t ron paul denounce the dirt that gets stuck in his shoes after walking across a muddy field.

    because it’s of no consequence!

    actually, the fact that dr. paul will still appear on alex jones’ show is impressive.

    in the past, jones was one of the few media outlets that would give dr. paul the time of day.

    now that his fortunes have changed, he won’t throw alex jones overboard for appearance sake.

    apparently ron paul actually has principles.

  • Truth

    Do all of you actually trust the Bush admin? What the hell is wrong with you. The offical version of the 9/11 events is b/s and a total coverup. Do we know exactly what happened? no, of course not. But we know that the official version is pure garbage. How about you respect that Ron Paul has the courage to speak with people who seek the truth no matter what the govt. tells them and despite the fact that all sorts of simple minded people will ridicule him. I cant believe this website is called the liberty papers. Most of these comments represent exactly what is wrong with this country. Really, someone out there answer the question of whether or not they fully believe the offical version of 9/11 is 100% correct. Answer the question and dont be a coward and simply spew ridicule.

  • fawston joe

    Since when is everyone in a free society responsible for others beliefs? The object is that the voices of the sane overwhelm those of the ignorant racist revisionist/deniers/truthers. The danger is found in systems void of freedom, where the ignorant racist revisionist/deniers/truthers have a monopoly on power/knowlege. Also, since when to authoritarians support Ron Paul? If they do they must not have a clue as to the objectives of authoritarianism and how the message of liberty is the antithesis of this. These fools always look to people to cling to, all candidates get them. Just preach the truth and the good will come to pass….in a free society.

  • Lee

    Why even waste the time telling us you’re “done with Ron Paul”? You could’ve just left and no one would’ve ever noticed.

  • Matthew

    Ron Paul isn’t pandering to anyone when he goes on Alex Jones. He’s been interviewed by Alex for over a decade. The listeners are all already supporters. I don’t see why he should stop now just because you’re offended.

  • http://publiusendures.blogspot.com Mark

    Truth:
    So, I guess my ears were fooling me when I heard the plane flying overhead? I guess they were fooling me when I heard the plane hitting the Pentagon a few moments later just a few hundred yards from my apartment? I guess the friends of mine who were on I-395 at the time didn’t see what they saw? Where were you on 9/11? If you weren’t in NYC or DC or NoVa, all I can say is this- you have no idea. None. If you weren’t there, I would respectfully ask that you stop trying to tell people who were there what they did and did not see.

  • recordman

    STRAW MAN ALERT!

  • James

    OK lets attack Ron Paul !!! hmmm…Nothing on his character…record…life history…I’ve got it! We’ll attack him for doing radio interviews! I would definitely not vote for ANY one who does interviews with people I don’t like. Wow, Am I ever smart…I think I’ll dance in the rain now.

    GO RON GO!

  • http://www.kaligulawired.com Kaligula

    Kevin:

    This is the actual interview today with Alex Jones.

    Ron Paul Interview

    And this is what has gotten you all worked up?

    You don’t like Alex Jones. i don’t particularly like him either, but how is he any different than the the likes of John Gibson, Bill O’Relly, Michael medved and those other cretans and whackjobs at the likes of Fox? Talk radio by definition is populated by blowhards and nuttery, that’s why I don’t listen to it.

    However, when you say the Paul campaign has become the gathering place for “Truther” morons, racists, neo-Nazis, Southern secessionists, fascists, conspiracy theorists, wannabe authoritarians, Birchers, and nativists, that’s just bullshit. The meeting place on the internet is RonPaulforums.com. Do you see any of that sentiment over there. Have you been to any meetup groups or rallies. Has there been any racist, neo-nazi sentiment? No!!!!

    You are just repeating the smears that I expect to read on the likes of Freep and Kos, but not here. Doug’s articles are one thing, but you are making an accusation against someone like me that I am associating with racists and Nazis and I don’t fucking particularly like it and am starting to wonder why in the hell I am reading this forum.

  • http://www.orderhotlunch.com Jeff Molby

    I don’t buy into any of the conspiracies, Mark, but that was a pretty hollow emotional appeal.

    I don’t think anyone denies that three planes hit three buildings and that is all your eyewitness accounts cover. It’s the rest of the story that Truth doubts.

  • http://publiusendures.blogspot.com Mark

    Jeff- one of the more common 9/11 conspiracy theories is that a missile rather than a plane hit the Pentagon. That is the theory I was attacking. I was not in NYC (obviously) so I will leave it to people who were there to make the arguments on that issue.

  • UCrawford

    You’re done with Ron Paul? Hell, Kevin, I had no clue that you even supported him in the first place. You certainly don’t share his foreign policy beliefs, you have a rather collectivist view of free speech, from the comments I’ve seen your libertarian credentials are somewhat dubious, so why would anyone think that you were in agreement with Ron Paul to begin with? Having you disassociate yourself from Ron Paul is kind of like having Bill Kristol or Rudy Guiliani disassociate themselves from Ron Paul…so what?

  • Duane

    Alex Jones and his listeners are the people that started this gigantic “revolution” thing. I’m one of them and very proud to announce that fact. But it isn’t about “Who started it” it’s about getting the message out. I see that you took this opportunity of him going on AJ’s show to find yet another way to smear him. This attack on us “troofers” is typical but what Ghandi said (which has now become cliche’d) that “First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win” holds true. Alex has said a line one time that I (and I don’t know if it’s his or not) but he said, “I want to be free and in order for that to happen, you have to want to be free too”. And the 9-11 thing is part and parcel to what is happening to our liberty’s. If the government would be transparent and answer serious questions in broad daylight, there would be much less skeptism amongst THE MAJORITY of Americans. The truth movement is completely tied to Ron Paul and the message he re ignites as everyone in this country ought to be “troofers”. Instead we get people like you who take everything your “loving guvment” has to say about any issue at their word. If the government ran studies have shown that 9-11 happened the way it has been said, then it’s fact. There is no need for any independent investigation…but wait, even if there was a need, Giuliani was a good lil’ soldier and hurried all of the evidence right the heck outta here and into China.

    Bring on the insults.

  • Truth

    No one is saying that planes didnt hit the buildings. Wake up. Yes that was all real. Give me a break. The questions are about how they were able to hijack those planes. who helped them. How did just the planes crumble 3 skyscrapers at free fall speed. Dude, the truth movement is made up of scholars, victims families, firefighters, police officers, and many people who watched the events happen. My question to you was whether or not you believe 100% in the official version and that it explains all. Answer that. Because to anyone who has any clue it is obvious that the official version is a disservice to all those like yourself who had to experience pain and suffering at the hands of terrorists. I wrote what I did because I respect those who want real answers and are willing to put their ass on the line to get it. That is why I dont shun the truth movement, and I have so much respect for Dr. Paul and his call for a new investigation. Just tell me if you think the official version is pure truth. Because if you dont then you would be a conspiracy theorist too. See, the official version is a conspiracy theory too, only it is one that is mostly fiction. those 19 men could have never pulled this off by themselves, and those building could never collapse how they did from the planes and jet fuel. There is more to the story. All I am saying my friend is to at least question. If you question then you may find out that there is more to the story than you first thought.

  • http://waronrhetoric.com Amir

    I’m personally “9/11 agnostic” since I’ve read a lot about it and realized that by now all truth about what happened is buried by ridiculous conspiracy theories or official government positions that leave out huge chunks of information.

    That said, the idea that elements of government are capable of despicable acts is not new. The Nazis rounded up my family and killed most of them in gas chambers—today you’re considered nutty if you deny that and 9/11 as an “inside job” doesn’t even come close to that. However, this self-righteous platitude stereotyping the campaign’s supporters and saying they represent some “freedom to fascism” movement, makes you look even nuttier than the people who believe some nutty conspiracy theories about 9/11. Are you really that dense?

  • Mike

    While you’re at it don’t listen to Joseph Stiglitz, Ann Coulter, and David de Rothschild for going on Alex Jones’ program also.

  • leanne

    Boy oh boy, aren’t we sounding elitist. Listen to us, we sound like the gop candidates.(Paul and his supporters aren’t real conservatives, kick ‘em out, they’ll only ruin our chances for the presidency) The thing is, now we’re doing it to each other.Face it, if you believe in freedom, you don’t go around trying to marginalize or silence those around you. Freedom isn’t all sunshine and roses. We had better ask ourselves if we can handle the freedom of others, even those whose views we disagree with. Ron Paul has a history of not pandering to special interest. It drives them crazy, because they want to mold him to their cause. Guess what. We’re doing the same thing. And now we’re acting sulky and petulant because we’re telling him to go against his principals of treating everyone fairly, and he wont pander to us. He’s running for president, not dictator. He either represents all of us, or none of us. The constitution doesn’t exclude truthers or white supremists, or conspiracy theorists, or hippys, or gun owners, or doctors, or lawyers, or students, or housewives, or god forbid, democrats.

  • John

    Please vote for Romney or Giuliani. They’re not crazy.

    Wait, they wanna blow up more countries.

    nm, vote Hillary.

    shit…

    Who’s running that doesn’t hate America?

    I guess I’ll stay with Ron Paul.

  • http://davelamarand.com Dave

    Hey Lost_In_Translation:
    We’re not suppose to like the government! It’s not suppose to play such a HUGE roll in our lives!
    well, I’m sure we wouldn’t ind it so much if it wasn’t corrupt. And if you don’t think it is… well …

    In case you need to to your homework:
    http://www.constitution.org/constit_.htm

  • http://www.thecrossedpond.com Brad

    However, when you say the Paul campaign has become the gathering place for “Truther” morons, racists, neo-Nazis, Southern secessionists, fascists, conspiracy theorists, wannabe authoritarians, Birchers, and nativists, that’s just bullshit. The meeting place on the internet is RonPaulforums.com. Do you see any of that sentiment over there. Have you been to any meetup groups or rallies. Has there been any racist, neo-nazi sentiment? No!!!!

    Can I just second that? I’ve been to probably 15 Ron Paul rallies in the last six months (and I go to all the after-parties) . I sell T-shirts to the crowds. I’m involved in a project to get 1000 volunteers to New Hampshire. I cover this beat pretty extensively on my own blog. Point being, I’m pretty keyed into the movement.

    I freely admit that there are a lot of Truthers hanging about. Hell, he’s the Truther candidate of choice. That really weirded me out a bit at first, but it took only a very short time to realize that, for the most part, they’re good guys. These aren’t people wanting to take anybody’s rights away. These aren’t hateful people. These aren’t people looking to do our country, or anybody they meet, any harm. And they’re not people looking to disrespect victims or people affected by 9-11, unless you believe those victims are only valuable insofar as as their deaths correspond to the official line, which is frankly more nutty than anything I’ve ever heard a Truther say.

    They just believe something that, to me, seems kooky and without evidence. I agree with you, actually, on that point—I just have no idea why that’s inherently offensive in any way. I don’t find JFK conspiracy theorists offensive either.

    Nor does the fact that the people in this country MOST distrustful of government would want to vote for the candidate who is most distrustful of government. I have no idea why that says anything about Ron Paul, or the movement, beyond that. Or why that’s a shock. Paul’s said, over and over again, that he finds their claims to be without evidence. I have absolutely no idea why anybody would ask him to declare them all bad people to boot. It’s a completely unreasonable expectation, and it’s wrong to boot.

    But, having met a thousand plus Ron Paul supporters and been to many, many events, I’m not lying or exaggerating when I say I’ve never met or heard from a SINGLE neo-Nazi or racist. I’ve no doubt that there are a handful somewhere, but I’ve certainly never seen them.

    99.9% of Ron Paul supporters I meet are like me, and you. Decent, honest, enthusiastic people interested in drawing a line in the sand for freedom.

    That we should judge a candidate by the 2 fucking guys who are his worst supporters is beyond me. Should we start cross-checking candidate donor lists against sex offender registries and declare one candidate the “Child Molester Candidate of Choice”? Should we declare Barack Obama an anti-Semite because he probably got a campaign contribution from somebody in the Nation of Islam?

    Seriously, I can sort of understand your compunction, Kevin. But before you write off the campaign because of a story that seems really, really important in some tiny corners of the blogosphere, go out to a campaign event. Hit the parties afterwards. Meet some Ron Paul people. Talk to them.

    If what you find is a bunch of Neo-Nazis, anti-Semites, and fascists, then I’ll pay for your train ticket out of here myself.

    What I expect you’ll find is the people are, by and large, just like you and me, interested in the same things you and I are. And it’s enormously, enormously relieving, not just from a Ron Paul perspective, but from an American one.

    But like I said, if you find otherwise, I’m buying.

  • Richard Wicks

    I don’t think the 9/11 “truthers” are all that nuts after having read Operation Northwoods which the government for ages denied existed.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Northwoods

    WTC 7 collapsed 20 minutes AFTER the BBC reported it’s collapse. It could be a coincidence, but what an amazing one. I checked and there were 3 other buildings of equal heigh that all survived it. WTC7 was also in another plaza across the street.

    Here’s the BBC’s explanation, what there is of it.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/theeditors/2007/02/part_of_the_conspiracy.html

    The BBC states the orignal tapes were lost which is somewhat suspicious, but it could be true.

    I don’t think anybody should be censored from saying anything, and I don’t see anything wrong with Paul allowing these people to speak and be heard. There ARE legitimate questions to be asked, and what drives so many of these people nuts is that there is complete silence when they are asked.

    People are too quick to dismiss the possibility that our government can’t be trusted which I personally find amazing when we’re in Iraq over weapons of mass destruction and after those ludicrous claims that Hussein was working with binLaden. Anybody that knows any Middle Eastern politics (and I study them) know that Hussein murdered religious leaders if he say them as a threat to his power – he didn’t want his country to become another Iran, and he the next Shah.

    The fact that Paul will talk to these people is actually very encouraging to me. Sure, they could be totally off the wall nuts, but a free society needs to let everybody sound off.

  • Joe

    Nice try Judy and Gubber supporters. Go get in your dresses now, there’s got to be some gay pride parade to march in this weekend. Keep the weak hit pieces comming!

  • Martha

    Some of you people (original poster included) need to take a step back and take a deep breath. We can look at this another way too. Ron Paul would loose the confidence of many more of his supporters by ticking through one by one each of the thousands of organizations and ideologies for the purpose of sanctioning or condemning them via a refund check, famous and high profile or not. I mean really, what is the higher priority here, making a white supremacist feel bad and you feel good by thumbing a nose at him and ripping up his check, or freedom of speech for everyone? I am a firm supporter of the idea that one of the best ways to make sure my own freedoms are safe is to work to make sure other peoples freedoms are safe. That means that white supremacists have the right to say whatever repulsive hogwash they want. We have laws you know to take care of them where they go overboard. How do you people know that big mouths with horrible things to say all over the country don’t know full well that Ron Paul is too decent to subscribe to 99% of what they believe, but they give him money because Ron Paul supports that nut’s right to say it. It really seems like the original post was written by someone who had a bad day and tried to make him/herself feel better by making up an imaginary hair or two to split while waiting for the tranquilizer to kick in.

  • rhys

    “I’ve come to the conclusion that a Ron Paul candidacy unless he repudiates these people who do not share the belief in liberty, will harm the overall freedom movement by giving the impression to the American people that “freedom” and “liberty” are just code words for fascism, racism, and conspiracy mongering like the “New World Order” and the “North American Union”.”

    Finally, the truth about your disdain for Paul surfaces. It’s sad that you find other’s perceptions of you and your freedom movement more important than freedom itself. Maybe you will get over yourself in time for the primaries, but if not, at least it seems like you are done slandering Paul.

  • Mr. C

    You know what Kevin? You’re 100% correct. I’m going to vote for Rudy instead of Ron Paul. At least Rudy only has a crooked former police chief and a sexual predator priest at his side. Much better than those crazy 9/11 conspiracy theory nuts and white supremists that support Ron Paul because they believe in freedom, liberty, and civil rights. Who needs those things any way? After all, the Constitution is only just some stupid piece of paper anyways.

    Of course, the above posted is sarcasm, you twit!

    Ron Paul 2008. Live Free or DIE.

  • Rolland

    Let me see, we have the 9/11 Truthers vs the Iraq has WMDs and is an immediate threat to the world crowd. Gee, I personally don’t believe that 9/11 was an inside job, but at least it hasn’t yet been proven to be a lie.

    Every one of the other GOP candidates besides Ron Paul and even some of the Dem candidates bought into the Iraq/WMD nonsense and this bonehead (that would be you Kevin) believes association (not endorsement mind you) with 9/11 Truthers disqualifies Paul as a viable candidate.

    I think it is pretty clear who the real kooks are.

  • NH

    Any person calling himself ‘libertarian’ who doesn’t understand about sovereignty, NAU, and monetary issues, isn’t worth appeasing. It’s clear to us that you are simply a slave to the state and the status quo.

    When Kudlow, Lufkin and Forbes all agree with Paul and others like Joseph Sobran, Pat Buchanan, John McLaughlin, Tucker Carlson, Joe Scarborough, Andrew Napolitano, George Will, Charles Goyette, Bill Maher, John Cafferty, Barry Goldwater Jr., and many many more speak so highly of him and his campaign is taking off like a rocket, your blog and your opinion mean quite little..

    /ignored

  • NH

    Oh yes…when you can’t attack a candidate, go find some supporters you don’t like and use them to attack him. Since when is a candidate attacked on the basis of his supporters? Never and not with anyone else.

    God if you could see the wackjobs for Hillary and Obama, and I don’t see them being asked to give back money from LaRAZA or Code Pink…do you?

    It’s pretty weak…your attempt to denounce Paul; the person who best educates, motivates and activates people and will continue to do so regardless of what happens in this campaign.

  • NH

    This guy is voting for Hillary for sure… his use of the title Liberty Papers ought to be outlawed.

  • O’Shaughnessy

    When Paul wins, his detractors will consider his victory a coup d’etat, but we Irish will consider it a miracle and more evidence he is deservin’ of sainthood.

    This whole thing reminds me of the movie ST. Ralph.

  • Jarrett

    The reason why Ron Paul doesn’t turn against the people on the fringes of our society and return their money is because he is the greatest pro-liberty presidential candidate of our era.

    His integrity is such that he will never actively reproach people for what they think or believe, and he will never seek to limit their freedom to do what they choose with their speech or their money.

    What happens at the margins of society is eventually what will happen to the rest of us. Right now, our government officials are incarcerating the marginal American and torturing foreigners. How long until this starts happening to the rest of us?

    Indeed, if we really loved freedom, we would all have an interest in protecting the rights and freedoms of the fringes of our society, even if their ideas and beliefs are repugnant to us. Ron Paul is leading us by example, as he does on so many different fronts, and that is why he has my vote.

  • Akston

    I wish you every good fortune on your search for a candidate who will only accept support from people on your personal approved list.

    Personally, I think your point of view is based on trivial, irrational, ill-considered, and flimsy associations. But I also think that way of the 9/11 conspiracy theorists at this point, yet support their search as well.

    Maybe they, or you, will someday produce meaningful evidence and it will convince me that the events I see as completely unrelated are indeed linked. That’s not where I’ll be putting my money, but I won’t rule it out entirely either.

    In my mind, that’s how liberty works. When it comes to decisions like yours or theirs, I can completely disagree with your view, and yet completely accept it as your choice for yourself. Tricky concept, I know.

    One of the challenges of liberty is honestly supporting liberty for those you disagree with.

  • http://www.thecrossedpond.com Brad

    Good post.

  • Michael

    If RP has to give his contributions back to the ‘high profile scumbags’, then Hillary has to give hers back to the military contractors -who may also be ‘high profile scumbags’, depending on who’s paying your bills. By the way, she’s received more, from those guys, than any other candidate.

    Sorry buddy, but even Michael Moore showed that Dems can be bought too. And I hate to rain on your parade even further, but if you really think there’s a difference between Dems and Reps, you’re lost.

    I’m 29 years old and I’ve never voted, much less registered. I’ve never seen a reason to support any of the real ‘high profile scumbags’. But I finally see one guy, that stands out, that’s not blowing smoke or flip-flopping… You can’t attack his character. So you attack him for the people that decide to support him. Well guess what, I’m an IATSE Local 600 Union member. And I’m voting for Ron.

    I knew exactly what the media was up to, when I first searched RP out on youtube. One of the first videos was ‘Strippers for Ron Paul’. They don’t have any dirt. Ron’s never solicited sex from little boys or e-mailed House Pages (yeah, I was a Senate Page also) or gotten a hummer from a White House staffer. So they have to pick out strippers and weirdos to identify as ‘the RP supporters’.

    So you have to decide if you’re going to continue being one of the sheep or if you’re going to SUPPORT YOUR OWN GUY AND QUIT TRYING TO BASH RP.

    I don’t think it’d be a stretch to find some wacko Christian that thinks the world’s going to end in 2010 that supports Huckabee. And I don’t think it’d be too hard to find some crackhead that wants to see his welfare check keep coming that supports Hillary or Obama.

    In other words, YOU’RE the one that’s been fooled. You only see what the media wants you to see and you parrot it, like it’s your own thought.

    And thanks for reminding me. I’m going to put a face on the welfare state in a youtube video that I’m sure you’ll get a link to.

  • IbitTheHook

    I’m not a racist/anti-semite/nazi, etc. I don’t believe in conspiracy theories.I consider myself a liberterian. The truthers? so what they are entitled to their free speech.
    So if Ron Paul went on a liberal show he somehow becomes a liberal? Don’t give me that crap. There are plenty of Ron Paul supporters who are not evil nor crazy. You are selfish, you know why? Because You are afraid of putting your own reputation at risk. You have placed your reputation before doing the right thing. Weak. I hate being associated with troothers and racists, etc. But I want to know I did the right thing not the easy thing when I’m on my deathbed. The groupthink media and top tier candidates will always try to make us look kooky. Sadly the Constitution is now kooky. Ron Paul has lit the fire of liberty in campuses all across the nation. I was on my way to becoming a liberterian and Ron Paul sealed the deal. If fighting for the Constitution is kooky then call me a kooky. I’ll take kooky over coward any day.

  • Ju-Jitsu

    Besmirching Paul as cozy with neo-nazis is a subtle way of saying he is anti-Jewish.

    Ron Paul doesn’t have a bias against any Jews, it is Israel-first and America-second Jews who have a blatant bias against Ron Paul.

    I think Ron Paul is a problem for Israel-first Jews because he challenges them to drop their group think which causes them to think of themselves as either elite or victim in relation to other groups.

    However, Paul challenges all groups to drop the mindset of being elite or victim. Social tensions do not arise when individuals mutually relate to all other individuals as human beings with the same set of inalienable rights, regardless of membership in any group.

    Differences in abilities are another matter and may cause one to think favorably or disfavorably towards another individual. If someone can’t carry a note, he or she doesn’t have a right to be hired as a singer.

  • zagalo

    This just shows how you are percieved by others around you is more important to you, than being free.

    Being a well respected slave doesnt cut it for some people. They dont care what they are associated with, they just want to secure their liberties.

  • zagalo

    Also the problem with truthers is not the fact that they dare accuse the US government. That mistrust is a very healthy thing.

    The problem is giving the government too much credit. Governments are experts on long term propaganda but they can not pull of a specific and detailed conspiracy. They are too incompetent for that.

  • Kevin Parker

    >Why even waste the time telling us you’re “done >with Ron Paul”?
    I think Lee asks one of the better questions of this thread.

  • ProbablyRepeatingAbove

    FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
    The Liberty Papers’ new header:
    “the liberty papers
    Reputation, Impressions, Property, Defending my ass, one post at a time.”

    I smell a hypocrite.

    So people who practice their freedom of speech (but are saying things you don’t like) should be denied their right to donate to their candidate of choice.

    Will people confuse liberty/freedom with
    fascism/racism, etc. maybe, so what ?! That’s their problem for being that ignorant.

    These crazy and hateful people have the right to assemble and express (nonviolently) their ignorant opinions.

    You would only have a point if the money was proven to be illegally raised like that Norman Hsu guy.

    You have lost all credibility. I will never forget this. If the statue of liberty could talk she would say “take me the f**k off your website!” She’s angry.

  • Freedom Junkie

    Hey Buddy,

    I’m not a 9/11 “Truther” moron, racist, neo-Nazi, Southern secessionist, fascist, conspiracy theorist, wannabe authoritarian, Bircher, or nativist. AND I support Ron Paul. So what gives? All my supporter friends are taxpaying citizens who want OUR government back in the hands of the people. You are a namecalling heckler.

    I have no problem sharing the country w/ these people, they have a voice because believe it or not, they are Americans too. You don’t have the monopoly on this brother.

    The way you are carrying on leaves no room for people who are different and is very authoritarian and fascist yourself. The very thing you criticize! My Goodness, you are so hypocritical.

    Anyway, we will pray for you and your tainted analogy of America. God have pity on your soul.

  • RantsIzWatdaInternetsIz4

    How dare Ron Paul go on a show that he was invited on!

    How dare he go on shows that he doesn’t agree with the audience 100%?

    How dare people exercise their rights!

    This is an outrage! *wagging finger*

    He will speak to anyone and preach the words of liberty. That’s what makes him so great. I can’t believe you took the time to twist that.

    *Burns photo of Kevin and while singing like a monk*

    You are dead to me.

  • Amy Miller

    Kevin,
    Please put down the crackpipe, finish drinking your Red Bull, and take your Ritalin! Freedom is for everyone, not just pseudo-classical liberals such as yourself. Just because Ron Paul appears on a radio or TV show doesn’t mean that he agrees with them. After all, he has been on Fox with Sean Hannity. You think Ron Paul agrees with and pals around with Sean Hannity?

  • K.T.

    Hate to tell you, but “liberty” is just about as outside the mainstream as these nut jobs… look in the mirror.

  • Bob L Rochester, ny

    Liberty applies to all people. Not just those whom we share beliefs with.

  • Garrett Babb

    Truthers all want the same thing, truth and transparency in government. If that was occuring in government during the Bush years then we would know the real reasons behind 9/11. Why is everyone so afraid of the truth? Who would get hurt if there was a new investigation of 9/11, really? Look, this election year is about the idea of freedom and the constitution. If you jumped aboard the bandwagon for other reasons then you missed the point, my friends.

  • Linda I

    Let’s see…hmmm,

    – Pervasive military footprint costing 1 Trillion/year
    – $9 Trillion in debt paying only the interest
    – $1+ Trillion in debt to China
    – $1+ Trillion in debt to Japan
    – Possible pre-emptive strike on Iran
    – Loss of Habeas Corpus
    – eminent domain
    – warrantless searches
    – Social Security lockbox empty and problem ignored
    – Real Estate credit bubble and subsequent burst, many families losing their homes

    – No Weapons of Mass Destruction – yet still in Iraq … 4320 US casualties, more than 600,000 Iraqi Casualties.

    Keep up the status quo? I don’t think so…

    Ron Paul has the vote of my entire family…11 votes. First time in our history that we all will vote for the same candidate.

    END THE WAR, bring home our children. We’ll work together to fix this mess….
    Go Ron Paul!

  • Freedom Junkie

    PS,

    Wake up out of your lil “I am America” bubble. You think the WTO is a conspiracy? What planet are you from? http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7932485454526581006

  • Pingback: Libertarians Break With Paul « The Van Der Galiën Gazette()

  • Joe

    Yeah, you should be the head of committee to oversee what kind of Americans can like what. That type of thinking fits perfectly with the tone set by this current administration. You focus on outside fringes and ignore the mass in the middle; not that one is any more or less valuable than the other.

    There’s a slew of candidates perfect for you. Ron Paul is obviously over your intellectual-head. Keep the smears going, it’s only adding fuel.

  • Pingback: Buck Naked Politics()

  • Darel99

    I always knew that the Liberty Papers would pull his at some point….. It just proves my point from former posts thats all. kevin it’s not really going to matter what position you take becuase I still support paul and so do millions of others.

    As far as Alex Jones I don’t support every view he offers but I have confimed many of his points with Ring worm radation and many other topics and he appears to be a very honest person.

    As far as 9-11 I saw a poll from CNN last summer that stated over 60% don’t belive the offical story of 9-11 and neither do i. So you really need to address 60% of our nation not just Alex Jones

  • js290

    Keep the smears going, it’s only adding fuel.

    It’s like the campaign said when responding to Mona Sharon… perhaps they are donating to Paul’s campaign to gain attention.

    By the number of responses to the know-it-all student from directional LouisianaU, he must be winning TheLibertyPaper’s internal pool on who can get the most responses from a blog post.

  • Freedom Junkie

    Why don’t you post everyone that is changing who they support Buck Naked, Oh I’ll help you out: This one is from Obama’s camp.

    http://www.obamala.com/

    My name is Marc Whittemore. I started the original grassroots group ObamaLA and carried it until it was 2,500 people strong. Having done substancially more homework now I am inclined to switch my vote.

    Make no mistake about it — I think Obama would make an AWESOME President — far better than any other stale “part of the problem” Democrat running. However. In case you have not noticed America is picking up “flush momentum” and going down the tubes FAST. We no longer have time for rehersals or inexperience. We MUST get it right and get it right this time. We don’t even have the luxury of voting along party lines if we are to get it right.

    And so. Even more surprising is that for the first time in my 32 years of voting I will be voting for a Republican president. And that Republican is Ron Paul. Listen people. And take the time to listen CLOSELY to Ron Paul — because, like the last, we can ill afford one more drastic idiot mistake in the White House. Lives depend on making the right choice — indeed our entire nation depends on the right choice this time.

    Sincerely,
    Marc Whittemore
    Los Angeles, CA

    ———

    PS the biggest supporters in my area are the Libertarians & Constitutionalists.

  • Class of ’76

    3 Points

    1.I’m a proud Ron Paul supporter, 911 truther, and a regular listener of the Alex Jones show. Ron Paul has never questioned the official story of 9/11, nor do I expect him to. He is NOT one of us. However, many 911 truthers trust Ron Paul for the same reason everyone else trusts him, he is a man of integrity and principle who would protect our rights and expose government secrecy.

    2. Just because we demand that the federal government tell the truth of why they couldn’t protect 3000 Americans from 19 hijackers with box cutters does NOT put us on the same level with racists, anti-semites, or neo-Nazi’s.

    3. It is also very revealing that you would be so quick to abandon Ron Paul because of one fringe supporter like Don Black. Have you forgotten that the same candidate supported by a despicable and fringe fascist has received more contributions from the military than all other Republofascist candidates combined? How fragile and weak your principles and convictions must be when you can’t support the candidate you believe in because you don’t like a few people who also believe in him.

  • andy

    “I’ve come to the conclusion that a Ron Paul candidacy unless he repudiates these people who do not share the belief in liberty, will harm the overall freedom movement by giving the impression to the American people that “freedom” and “liberty” are just code words for fascism, racism, and conspiracy mongering like the “New World Order” and the “North American Union”.”

    Just because doing something right may give some bad impression is really, really a BAD reason not to do it.

    Look at Ron Paul: He speaks against drug on wars. This gives an impression that he likes drugs.
    He is against foreign intervention. This gives an impression of not pursuing right of self-defense.
    He is against “free trade agreemants”. Makes impression of being against free trade.
    He is against state provided health care. Makes impression of being against good and affordable health care for US citizens.
    He is against anti-discrimination laws. Makes impression he is a racist or that he supports racist.
    He is against anti-trust laws. Makes impression of being pro-big-corporations.

    I have great respect for a person who pursues a right goal even if it makes a bad impression. I have great respect for Ron Paul, because he speaks the right thing although it is very unpopular. “Guilt by association” is an unacceptable argumentation technique. I admire Ron Paul for not screening his donors, although it GIVES IMPRESSION of supporting them.

  • Robert Moore

    There will always be truthers out there as long as the government lies and manipulates reporting, data and statistics. Many of the truthers provide us with a valuable service. For example, look at shadowstats.com. It is important that we get the truth and unfortunately we have to get it from alternative sources since the government is not in truth-telling business.

  • Chris Kachouroff

    I volunteer for the campaign. It has not become a gathering place for 9/11 truthers and etc.

    Kevin, what have you done for Ron Paul? I dare say scant little. If you had you wouldn’t have written what you did. You have made a conclusion based on a sampling error.

    The Campaign has many folks who believe in the Constitution. You can be done with Ron Paul in terms of writing about him. You can’t be done with his message to be sure, right?

  • Althusius

    All these same groups endorsed Ronald Reagan in 1976. The Gerald Ford elites said Reagan was a kook and a right wing nut. Does all this sound familiar?

  • charles ranalli

    since when has “truth” – about 9-11 or anything else for that matter – become a bad thing ? or is it that you are just basically uncomfortable with “truth” per se – perhaps because it is something so foreign to yourself ? and as for “white pride” – i don’t find that notion any more or less repulsive than say “black pride” or “jewish pride” – only i don’t hear much criticism of these other positions. so as per usual we seem to be dealing with a lot of hot air and hypocrisy here. God bless you Kevin. and by God’s grace and mercy may we be so blessed as to have such a good American as Doctor Ron Paul alive and well in the white house to restore our dear country to peace prosperity freedom and sanity.
    charles ranalli
    albuquerque new mexico

  • jmklein

    Wow, that sounded kooky and crazy.

    I for one will vote the candidate who wants to get us out of Iraq, restore the dollar and protect my constitutional liberties.

  • aaron

    Dude you might as well move out of the US. Or go crawl under a rock. Seriously this is a diverse country with diverse views. Supporting a particular candidate does not associate you to the other supporters. That said who are you going to vote for if not Ron Paul?

  • http://jeremydyoung.blogspot.com Jeremy D. Young

    Kevin, please show me how, and in what manner he has changed his message even the slightest to specifically draw in ANY group of people. Ron Paul is a man of integrity and honesty. He answers all questions asked of him in a straight forward fashion. He has had the same basic principled message for the last 30 years.

    What does his appearance on other venues mean?

    CNN? Bill Maher (who hates 9/11 truthers)? PBS? NPR? Fox? CBS? NBC? etc etc etc

    If being asked questions by a journalist, or at minimum an entertainer causes you to share their views, then what on EARTH does Ron Paul believe with the list of places he’s appeared?

    You cannot claim that just because a group of people that hold a misguided belief support Ron Paul that it is his duty or necessity to repudiate all their beliefs. Why does he have to start being prejudiced against groups of people? He is a champion of treating people as individuals.

    Bottom Line:
    No one’s support or donation changes his message or his stances on issues. Why does it matter who supports him? Vote based on whether you agree with his stated positions, and whether you believe based upon his record that he is telling the truth.

    Oh, and PLEASE everyone that claims to support Ron Paul STOP with the name calling. It is time to rise above the fray. If you cannot say something politely and respectfully, please leave the comments to those of us who can.

  • John V

    Hey, Kevin,

    A Venture Capitalist and all around normal guy is spending $85,000 of his own money to put a full page ad in this weekend’s USA Today in support of Ron Paul. He’s not a nut or a kook.

    In doing so, he’s doing much more than kook who slipped Paul a few bucks.

    Why is this not the example of a typical Ron Paul supporter? Why do we choose to make a big deal out of small pockets of people who in all likelihood only represent a minute fraction of his supporters?

    I’m a Ron Paul supporter and just a normal American who wants less government, lower taxes and a peaceful foreign policy.

    I AM THE POSTER BOY RON PAUL SUPPORTER….NOT ALEX JONES.

    Jones can kiss my ass but I welcome his vote. I Alex likes Paul because he wants smaller government and a different foreign policy, he’ll be happy. But if he is making illusions that some of his kooky views will be given attention in a RP WH, he’s sorely mistaken and he’s a sucker.

  • John V
  • warren

    amazing how everybody from all walks of life are interested in freedom. it’s a shame that the writer don’t believe that all men should have an equal opportunity to it.

  • Randy Merz

    Legitimate problems, I’m sure, but the one thing Mark keeps saying over and over again that I haven’t noticed anyone specifically address is that Paul is focusing actual resources on courting truthers and white nationalists.

    Is he, actually? I really don’t see calling in to a radio show when he’s at home as ‘devoting a significant amount of resources to specifically please a small segment of crazies’. The way I see it, Ron Paul sees a show that has a likeness with some of his views and it’s close to home, so it’s a platform with which to throw his message out there. That’s all he’s doing. He’s not spending 2 million dollars making TV ads insinuating that 9/11 was an inside job, all he’s doing is spreading his message in whatever venue he can get.

    I don’t know what ‘significant’ resources he’s putting through to cater to a ‘specific’ group, when it’s a nationally syndicated radio show. He’s just speaking his regular jive on a media that reaches a lot of people, he hasn’t changed a thing.

  • mike

    Ron Paul will represent all americans. As far as I know 9/11 “Truther” morons, racists, neo-Nazis, Southern secessionists, fascists, conspiracy theorists, wannabe authoritarians, Birchers, and nativists are still americans. The constitution says We The People not just the people I agree with. There are some who believe that the earth was created less than 10000 years ago, are they not deserving of representation when we know they are wrong? I a way I would be happy if you were againest Ron Paul. This way the real kooks are on the otherside

  • http://www.thesparsematrix.com rho

    It’s clear that Kevin is not a critical thinker. Because Ron Paul goes on Alex Jones’ show he’s a “Truther”? You are incapable of rational thought.

    Pretty sure you weren’t really all that strong of a Ron Paul supporter to begin with either. You have just been looking for an excuse to jump ship.

    It’s funny–Ron Paul does not have a problem with people holding strange or kooky views so long as they are not forcing those views on other people via force, and is willing and able to bring these people to the table with the message of liberty. You, on the other hand, cannot do likewise. Which doesn’t make you a “classical liberal”, it makes you an authoritarian.

  • Moto

    Why would this Liberty Papers “quit ron paul” ? He’s the only reason anyone outside of your clique ever visits this site.

  • Brad

    Answer these questions for me:

    Did Ted Kennedy Kill Someone? Did He Leave The Scene Of The Crime? Is He Still In Office?

    As can be determined from the above questions having a yes answer to them.

    Conspiracy Exists; It is a matter of where you draw the lines.

  • Hugh G. Knutts

    Kevin, looks like you made the right choice. Just take a look at the response on your blog and their nature.

    I find it ironic, that “troofers” (young angry white males with low IQs, in most cases) are the champions of pretending to ask questions, while in reality, doing everything in their power to tear America down. These same “troofers” demand answers to canards, but when you raise legitimate questions, they want to silence you with the very freedom they pretend to champion.

    Good riddance to them, I say. alex jones makes his living suckering money out of young gullible people by pimping out delusion, alternate reality and fear while profiting off the deaths of Americans killed on 9/11 and in the subsequent war. And ron paul panders to this nutjob, not once, not twice, but four times in a year and untold numbers of times over the past decade.

    The kind of people that represent ron paul are right here in this thread, attacking you for a personal decision on raising legitimate concerns that linger on and on and on, with no response from ron paul or his campaign. When you were with them, they were your friends (out of convenience). When you took a stand over something legitimate, they turned their back on you. Who wants to be associated with people like that?

    There’s nothing more honorable than a man who takes a stand based upon principles that go to the core of his moral values. I commend you for doing so. Have a happy Thanksgiving and don’t let paulistinians get to you.

  • Eric

    rho said:

    Which doesn’t make you [referring to Kevin] a “classical liberal”, it makes you an authoritarian.

    An authoritarian? Really? Tell me how an individual who says he will not support someone politically as a matter of principle is an authoritarian. If you can do that, then I might listen to your arguments. Of course, since your comment is completely full of logical fallacies, I doubt that you can convince me of any such thing.

    The hardcore Ron Paul supporters commenting on this blog have convinced me that logical, critical thinking is a completely lost art.

  • Eric

    Moto said:

    Why would this Liberty Papers “quit ron paul” ? He’s the only reason anyone outside of your clique ever visits this site.

    The Liberty Papers is not going to “quit Ron Paul”, Kevin is. Kevin speaks for himself, not for “The Liberty Papers”. The only person who can speak for TLP is the individual owner, Brad Warbiany. Your comment betrays a collectivist approach and muddy thinking.

    Oh, by the way, your second sentence is incorrect and can be shown statistically using visitor logging tools. Less than 25% of all visitors to TLP arrive via search engines and/or search strings related to Ron Paul. Out of an average of 60,000 unique visitors per month. Shrugs, it probably makes you feel better, though, to say that.

  • Randy Merz

    Come on, guys. Jumping on the folks who argue for Ron Paul with little respect? Welcome to the internets. Everybody does it.

  • Eric

    What the heck are you talking about Randy? The Ronulans have been engaged with respectful, critical thinking for the most part. Lately, their inability to think critically or logically has gotten so tiresome that intelligent Ron Paul supporters have been taking them on. Welcome to the Internet, where folks spew forth unintelligible thought and think they have shown their point to be valid.

  • uhm
  • Akston

    Judean People’s Front? We’re the People’s Front of Judea! Splitter!

  • Bill B

    The ‘New World Order’ conspiracy is real. The banking conspiracy is real. The monetary system itself is a big conspiracy.

    9/11 inside jobbiness is debatable, I’m right there with you, but Alex Jones is right about a lot. Many high profile people in politics and government around the world are on his show because they agree with one of his idea’s or another, not innately all of them.

    If you don’t even know our monetary system is a doomed scam, read anything by Nobel prize winning economist Milton Friedman or any of Ron Paul’s economic works. Or any of a half dozen excellent documentaries like ‘The Moneymasters’ or ‘Money as Debt’. All are available for free on youtube or google video.

  • http://blog.myspace.com/freedomphiles RSDavis

    Since Ron Paul first really caught people’s attention in his argument with Rudy about blowback from 50 years of meddling in Middle Eastern politics having a lot to do with the 9/11 attacks, wouldn’t it be pretty stupid for someone to think that Ron Paul believes it is an inside job?

    – Rick

  • http://www.realestatedecline.com Jerm

    What happened to WTC7? Anyone care to take a guess. Does anyone on this website even know what WTC7 is?

    If you don’t look at the evidence then you really need to hold your peace about Ron Paul supporters!

  • uhm

    WTC7 fell down. There is documented proof that it fell down. Truthers and supporters of our foreign policy are paranoid and delusional. They need to lay off the magical thinking. These ideas spring from the same place in your minds as Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny. Faith without reason is destructive.
    http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/23/health/psychology/23magic.html

  • leanne

    I think that we are seeing the growing pains of the campaign. All of us are having to examine what freedom really means to us. Let’s not be hypocrits. Remember the saying,”I might not agree with what you say, but I’ll fight to the death for your right to say it.” The message of limited government and freedom attracts diverse groups. The moment we start saying that one group deserves to be represented and not the other, we are acting like authoritarians.Freedom requires checking your ego at the door. If we are so worried about how we are perceived by others,that we are willing to marginalize others, then we’ve missed the boat. It’s better to live the principals, than to pay lip service to freedom, and then pander to the masses by shutting out the truther, conspiract theorists, ect. Look, these people may not be politically correct, but political correctness isn’t freedom, it’s a form of social engineering fed to you through media and lobby groups. Who do we get rid of next? The smokers, the prostitutes, the gun owners, the obese, the christians, the drinkers, trailer park habitants, trekkies,rappers,…Who? This movement was started by rebelious free thinkers, not sheep who beleive and do everything they’re told. Rebelious free thinkers have a history of not conforming to peer pressure. If you want barbie and ken as the main core of this movement, I think you will be sorely disappointed.

  • Paul Revere II

    I’ve been listening to Alex Jones a long time and I find most of what he says is actually TRUE! Check it out for yourself, these elites are scum! Not all but most just as historys shows.

    Now Ron Paul knows alot of things fed to the public are b.s. Ron Paul knows there’s rampant corruption but it cannot be completely called out…..To to so would be political suicide and actual suicide..

    Bush is a War Criminal-Fact!

    Ron Paul is not mixed up with it all but he knows- And for you Ron Paul Haters you need to know your ABSOLUTELY Brainwashed- The News is slanted with lies, white lies and It’s all true- It’s 6 years now snce 911 and Bush tries to merge us with Mexico!!!!!!! WAKE UP DUMB ASSES YOU BAFFOONS!!!!

    SO NOW TELL ME WHAT HILLARY ROTTON CLINTON IS GUNNA DO FOR THE N.W.O.?????

    WAKE UP! WAKE UP! WWWWWWAAAAAAKKKKKEEEEUUUUUPPPP!

    Paul Revere II

  • Eric

    Wow, all I can say is just wow to Paul Revere II’s comment.

  • http://www.freedomsphoenix.com Fascist Nation

    Having worked on many occasion with 9/11 Truthers to further Ron Paul’s campaign I will say politics indeed makes strange bedfellows, and I have seen them our their heart and souls into his campaign. I am forced to ponder, just what has your contributions been that I give a shit about whether you stick around for freedom?

  • Ithink4MySelf

    The “Truth Movement” Does Not Equal The Ron Paul Revolution

    Every time you bring up conspiracy theory talk you hurt Ron Paul’s chances.

  • trigonx

    All this attention to convert one person to support Ron Paul. I’m also victim, i wasted a lot of time on this page. There are far too many undecided voters to convert than wasting hours of time here with this guy.

  • http://qwickset.blogspot.com Tim

    Ermm….what country do YOU live in? If your answer is “the United States of America”, then you need to revisit why you started to like Ron Paul in the first place. Was it because you thought…”his policies are perfect for ‘Americans like me’?” If that’s the case, then I implore you to be on your way. The country you apparently think you live in is one in which “Freedom of Speech” only pertains to fellow citizens who hold your beliefs and ideals. This, in fact, is not the America that our forefathers intended.

    As “Champion of the Constitution”, Ron Paul represents EVERY AMERICAN. By supporting Ron Paul you do not associate yourself with these types of people you listed — you associate yourself with EDUCATED, INFORMED and CONCERNED AMERICAN CITIZENS. If you do not like the fact that your fellow Americans are not perfect, you best grab a one-way ticket out.

    I fear the country types like you end up with if you base your voting on the supporters of a candidate rather than the candidate’s message and merit. Seriously, that’s about as backwards as voting for who you think is going to win instead of who you want to win.

    Lastly, if you seriously think the “New World Order” and the “North American Union” are just for “troofers”….

    From Daddy Bush’s own mouth…
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7a9Syi12RJo

    NAU/SPP…
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVe_sZkvRY8
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIRK1y52FTQ
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T74VA3xU0EA

  • Linus

    Ahh… that’s it. Someone might call YOU……troofer! That would be too high a price to pay for Liberty!

  • ed clark

    Let me guess, Arron Russon is a kook too, and Ron Paul should repudiate him or the megaphone will crank up more hack posts.

  • Isaac

    I’m done with the Liberty Papers…

  • Isaac

    Also, I just thought I point out how collectivist that is of you, to lump people into groups and assume the group is homogeneous because of one association.

  • Abdul

    Yes, Great post! That Ron Paul Nazi sympathizer has got to go. What in the hell does he think he is doing? The wars MUST go on forever. Wars are the health of the state and good for the economy. Who cares that US occupations cost tax payers a trillion dollars a year. Americans are just going to have to make sacrifices and give up all of their rights if they expect government to keep them safe. We can NEVER sleep as long as there is even one islamofacist diaperhead still alive. Kill’em all! Let’s turn the entire middle east into nothing but a sheet of glass. Hell! Why stop there? We need a 95% population reduction implemented ASAP worldwide by making sure every global non-producer gets their FREE vaccines. Get this, Paul actually wants to shrink the size of government. Ha ha ha! The bigger the better I always say. Ron Paul is so out of touch with reality. Imagine, he wants to abolish the Fed to bring back sound money. A greatly devalued dollar makes products cheaper here at home, only imports will cost more. So what if all of the USA’s manufacturing has all been exported overseas. There are still lots of domestic products they can still buy, right? Many countries now are refusing to take any more US dollars, calling them, “worthless pieces of paper.” Screw’em all! We’ll just declare bankruptcy and leave them all holding an empty bag. That will serve them right!… Ingrates. Anyway, who cares. We already have our brand new Amero currency ready to go (50 trillion of them). The printing presses are currently rolling at full speed. Go ahead fools, use the Irish punt as the world’s currency. Electing Ron Paul is just a bad idea all the way around. I mean, for crying out loud, he is not even a CFR member. Only CFR members are allowed to be US presidents (don’t you idiots know anything?). So vote for any OTHER candidate EXCEPT Ron Paul. Our new president MUST have the right credentials. Get this, Ron Paul is only supported by the little people (useless eaters) and won’t even take contributions from special interests. One cannot win the presidency with chump change. If Ron Paul ever hopes to get elected he had better open up the coffers to the industrialized military complex and special interest groups to raise hundreds of millions of dollars. Lastly, we must do whatever we have to do to keep this constitutionalist nut-job from getting any more popular than he is. As our hero G.W. Bush has said, “Stop throwing the constitution in my face, it’s nothing but a goddamn piece of paper.” Now, we all know that we cannot smear Ron Paul himself (too squeaky clean for that), so let’s go after his supporters and paint them all as white supremacists, neo-Nazis, and conspiracy theorists. Again, congratulations on the great Ron Paul smear job. Keep up the wonderful work. If we continue to all work hard together, we can stop freedom, liberty and prosperity dead in its tracks. Death to the USA! Up with the NWO! Mwahahahahahahaahaha!!!!!!

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  • Boston Dan

    Is there a bigger fraud than this Kevin clown?

    This is from one of his previous blog entries.

    “Our readers and commenters range from the anonymous to such famous folks as David Friedman and David Duke.”

    When it comes time to tooting his own horn, Kevin is proud to be associated with David Duke.

  • http://thelibertypapers.org/2005/11/21/who-is-eric/ Eric

    That’s my blog entry Dan, or can’t you read the line at the bottom that says “Posted By: Eric”? This blog has 14 contributors, which you can find on the sidebar fairly easily if you try.

    On a side note, I’m not proud to be associated with David Duke, but you did a fine job of selectively quoting out of context.

  • WRR

    Bravo — the cult will try to crucify you — that is the nature of the lunatics Paul has accumulated along the way. But good for you.

  • JP

    Whats so bad about Alex Jones.

    TALKS about North American Union – not a conspiricy, accutually happening.
    TALKS about Bilderbergers – Real meetings, what are they talking about anyway?
    TALKS about 9/11 – Maybe he gets carried away, but there IS something we’re not being told. (If you think WTC7 fell by itself, YOURE the moron).
    HURTS nobody.
    I don’t see the problem.

  • http://publiusendures.blogspot.com Mark

    …Shaking head in amazement at JP and Paul Revere II.

    Anywho, just a little self-plug here- I put together a more sober explanation of why I gave up on the revolution here:
    http://publiusendures.blogspot.com/2007/11/why-i-quit-revolution.html

  • http://www.orderhotlunch.com Jeff Molby

    On a side note, I’m not proud to be associated with David Duke, but you did a fine job of selectively quoting out of context.

    It’s certainly a selective quote, but I don’t see how it’s out of context. You were trumpeting this site’s accomplishments and you went out of your way to point to his comments as an example of that.

    I’m glad to see that you’ve clarified your initial remarks, but you do still have a link to Duke’s site. You should change it to Wikipedia or at least add a nofollow attribute.

  • http://thelibertypapers.org/2005/11/21/who-is-eric/ Eric

    Shrugs, why? Because I shouldn’t send people there? They can find his link on their own easily enough. Or because I shouldn’t give him a link?

    Aside from that, I merely pointed out the range of well known people that had left comments on our site. Although not as badly out of context as some newspapers are wont to do, it’s still a nice bit of twisting by Dan.

  • http://www.orderhotlunch.com Jeff Molby

    Shrugs, why? Because I shouldn’t send people there? They can find his link on their own easily enough. Or because I shouldn’t give him a link?

    To avoid the appearance of hypocrisy. I’m sure you know that modern search engines work by creating associations between sites and you’ve stated several times that you don’t wish to associate yourself with Mr. Duke.

    Aside from that, I merely pointed out the range of well known people that had left comments on our site. Although not as badly out of context as some newspapers are wont to do, it’s still a nice bit of twisting by Dan.

    I have no hostility towards you, but I read it the same way Dan did. It was an odd place to mention a man with whom you do not wish to associate.

  • Jason

    I read alot of people not wanting to “associate” with people like Neo-Nazis, troofers, etc.. Well you do it everyday, they are American, like myself, like probably some of you.
    Keep in mind, the first Europeons who came to this country were people that had crazy religous beleifs (Salem witch trial?) Penial colonist (Just like Austrailia) and greedy aristocrats (Like Columbus and others) So because our Europeon ancestors were “kooks” we should deny they ever existed? Give me a Break. Ron Paul beleives in a philosphy of Life, Liberty, and persuit of Happiness under the rule of Law, the contract of the people and the federal goverment; The Constitution. That is the root philosophy of our country beginings, and yes we have people we don’t agree with that are american. The message Dr. Paul talks about brings together everyone, .. let me say that again EVERYONE! You can’t be president and pick and choose who your going to govern, you have to accept America as it is.

  • Glen

    The whole premise of this argument is nonsense. The premise is that a candidate for office should not appear on a radio program whose host has an objectionable agenda. Ron Paul, and every other candidate, has appeared on FOX, CNN, PBS, MSNBC, ABC, NBC, CBS, PBS, and has been interviewed by the NY Times, Washington Post, Wall Street Journal, Chicago Tribune, Boston Globe, LA Times, and on and on and on.

    Every one of these news outlets has been accused of having a hidden political agenda while masquerading as unbiased and “fair and balanced”.

    Continued…

  • Glen

    To expect a candidate to shun media coverage because the particular outlet has or is perceived to have a political agenda is to ask that candidate to not evangelize his message. And that is asking the candidate to commit political suicide.

    It’s not where a candidate appears that is important. It’s what he says in the appearance. If he agrees with the agenda of every news outlet he appears on, then he is a panderer. If he simply and consistently speaks his message, then he should not be castigated for speaking the good message through a microphone owned by the objectionable.

  • Bill

    All this hype about Ron Paul being on Alex Jones show . My guess would be 90% of the people that claim Alex Jones is a KOOK have never watch one of his documentary … Now Whos The KOOK
    You can not watch Loose change and walk away and say humm they do not have any valid points . Truth can handle any lie what are people afraid .. Its funny to me that most people believe or Gov IS currupt but cannot believe they would do any thing wrong very strange indeed

  • http://texasfred.net/ TexasFred

    I am certainly not a Libber, classical or otherwise, but I am thinking that you’re a pretty smart individual…

    Ron Paul is a moonbat, and his supporters are more like rabid little attack poodles than anything else…

    Yesterday I ran a couple of anti Ron Paul stories as an experiment, and all of these so-called FREEDOM LOVERS sent me some of the nastiest comments imaginable, and I spent ALL of my life as a Marine or working in a law enforcement environment and I have heard it all, or thought I had…

    The Paulies DEMANDED that I accept their stance and told me, TOLD ME, to STFU, in my own blog, not in one of theirs, not in a Ron Paul blog, in MY OWN BLOG, they sought to infringe on MY right to free speech…

    Yea, neo-NAZI is a very good description of these moonbats…

    Kudos to you…

  • Kris

    The only reason I clicked on this site is because it said “The Liberty Papers”. Ok, so I think I was wrong. I see many of the comments are very hateful, mean and as a Ron Paul supporter I will definitely stay away from sites like these. Sites like these bait you to create chaos, confusion and hate and then claim they are for “Liberty”. I never comment on hate sites like these except I felt I needed to tell the Ron Paul supporters, don’t fall for these tactics. They give out misinformation on purpose to antagonize you. Don’t fall for it! If we didn’t comment, think how boring this site would be!!

  • Eric

    What misinformation Kris?

  • Tom

    To the Original poster. Slander and belittle some more please.It lends to your lack of Knowledge.

  • Brian Miller

    Ron Paul’s supporters in the “libertarian movement” have no soul.

    They’re willing to sell out gays, women, immigrants, urban residents, and others to predation by the state if it’s a “state’s rights” argument — solely to satisfy their gold-bug fetishes and other pet issues.

    I’m glad that other libertarians are calling out this odious man’s odious campaign for the apologia for statism that it truly is.

    His willingness to transform his campaign into a money machine — and worse, the idiotic stupor in his followers that blinds him to this obvious goal — is exceeded in awfulness only by the sheer lack of principle of his most angry followers.

    I’ve tried to be nice to them. I’ve saved my criticism for his campaign. But after today, I’m going to start to point out the obvious.

    There’s something morally defective about “libertarians” who make “states’ rights” arguments for government oppression of citizens.

    There’s something morally defective about “libertarians” who are happy to trade off the rights of gays, or women, to get political advantage for themselves.

    There’s something morally defective about “libertarians” who will make common cause with neo-Nazis, racists, and insane morons like David Duke and Alex Jones, and defend them as though the criticism of them is without basis.

    There’s something morally defective about “libertarians” who will blatantly lie and claim, as part of their campaigns, that the “Libertarian Party endorses Ron Paul.”

    There’s something morally defective about “libertarians” who are willing to bullyrag other libertarians into silence, or explain to them how their rights are “a narrow cross-section of civil rights” — as though they’re under obligation to sell out their own freedom to right-wing nuts in exchange for some gold-buggery.

    There’s something morally defective about “libertarians” who are willing to spam and relentlessly attack critics of their Holy God, without regard for the facts, with a singular mission of power for themselves.

    There’s something morally defective about “libertarians” who are willing to attack other libertarian (and Libertarian) candidates who are actually MORE libertarian than their own.

    There’s something morally defective about “libertarians” who raise millions of dollars in campaign cash, but spend virtually none of it on the actual campaign. There’s something even more morally defective about refusing to commit to return the unspent money to contributors at the campaign’s end.

    No more Mr. Nice Faggot here, folks. From now on, your immoral campaign will be pointed out for what it is. Your immoral friends, your blood money from nazis, racists and anti-Semites, your affiliations with crazy fringe groups in favor of state power being used to crush the “unworthy,” and your willingness to apologize for all of these betray your fundamental immorality.

    You can scream, cry, attack me in public, spam the site until you’re green in the face, huff and puff and blow our collective houses down, but your cacophony of rage and bullying will not cover up your moral defectiveness *and* your lack of character, in teaming up with the lowest of the low and shrugging off your principles in order to get a little power for yourselves at others’ expense.

    May your campaign fail brilliantly — as it already is. And may history forget you called yourselves “libertarians.”

  • josh m

    Note this is not over anything Paul has done, but over something he hasn’t done, in response to the actions of others. First, Paul has already categorically stated he doesn’t believe 9/11 was an ‘inside job’, and the campaign has distanced itself from one of the offensive groups in question. I disagree that such relatively benign ‘negative’ action is grounds for such criticism.

    And even if he met your demands to retain your support (which I doubt he ever had in the first place), there would still others for whom nothing short of a marathon self-flogging (a la ‘Dog’ the Bounty Hunter) would be enough to attain atonement for the sin of not being politically correct. I say good for Paul for not caving in to the PC police (whose ranks you apparently populate) on this.

    “Bill Clinton repudiated Sister Soljah. George H.W. Bush repudiated David Duke. Pat Buchanan repudiated the white nationalists every time they backed him for his presidential runs. Why can’t Ron Paul?”

    Let me get this straight, the fact that Paul doesn’t do something slimy career politicians Clinton and Bush did makes Paul unacceptable. Let’s just think about that one.

  • Jim

    Brain sez: “They’re willing to sell out gays, women, immigrants, urban residents, and others to predation by the state if it’s a “state’s rights” argument — solely to satisfy their gold-bug fetishes and other pet issues.”

    It’s not selling out. Pandering to special interests based on abitrary gender/gender choice/race issues is no longer a luxury that Americans can afford.

    That divisive crap has been killing us for far too long.

    “No more Mr. Nice Faggot here, folks.”

    A little self-dignity might help to ameliorate the rage.

  • uhm
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  • Jack

    What? and you don’t think that cooks follow Clinton of Thompson? You really are a fool that you will look at the man and not the message. Infact your not even looking at the man your looking at the people who like him. Ron Paul is the only true Conservative Libertarian that is running.

    RON PAUL 08!