“Meanwhile… McCain is some sort of bizarre hybrid of Dr. Strangelove and Joe Lieberman who can’t stop repeating ‘My friends, I was a foot soldier in the Reagan revolution’. And then we’ve got Huckabee, who believes the Earth is 6,000 years old.”

I never said the alternatives were an improvement. :-)

Look, I’ll point out once again that I said that *some* Paul supporters are kooks. I also said that some are reasonable and rational. From your replies, I’d put you in the reasonable and rational column, whereas James…well I think you can guess where I’d rank him. I just think the kooks have become what people *see* out on the internet and public because for some reason they seem to be generating a level of noise above and beyond what I’m sure their proportion is in the overall population of Paul voters (at least, I *hope* that is out of proportion…). And I frankly think that that segment of the Paul Supporter population does more to hurt him than they do to help. Stifling questions with threats and insults, spamming boards that have absolutely not the faintest thing to do with politics, being insulting to anyone that doesn’t immediately utter total fanatical support for Paul (referring to anyone that doesn’t run to the Paul bandwagon as “sheeple” seems to be one I’ve come across, but just generally using names like “moron”, “idiot”, “fascist”, etc, too), all these things probably do more to drive people away from, rather than toward, supporting Paul.

Another problem Paul has in getting the word out is that his campaign has relied very heavily on the internet. That wouldn’t be bad if it weren’t that it seems to be that (with a few exceptions) his campaign doesn’t seem to be complementing that with hitting the traditional airwaves with effective marketing in most areas. And the problem with that is that a big bloc of voters isn’t really so internet savvy – seniors and other older adults. That demographic makes up a big part of the frequent voter population, but (around here at least) it doesn’t appear that there’s any particular effort to get the word out via traditional means (i.e., t.v. and radio ads) that would reach them.

“who are you voting for again?” Well, my original question was asked on another board awhile back and needless to say the nomination landscape has changed massively since then. I’m frankly terribly conflicted. Paul’s ideas are interesting, but some of his history and associates leave me cold (I’m not a big fan of Lew Rockwell and his adherents, and the newsletter issue gives me the horrors because if the man couldn’t keep an employee on the small staff of his own newsletter published by a company with his name on it in line, that to me does not speak at all well of his ability to, for example, keep cabinet members in line, keep federal agencies in line, appoint competent judges, etc.) As some others have said, it’s not that I thik Paul *himself* is a bad man; but I’m afraid that he may prove to be a bad judge of character and surround himself with the wrong people (imagine if someone like his newsletter writer were put in a cabinet position, where he could do real damage to a Paul presidency with a few strokes of a pen. Or, on another thread here it’s been discussed that Paul appointed a very young, very inexperienced person as his press secretary with apparently far less than stellar results. Imagine that being done with political appointments (oh, wait, we don’t have to imagine…think back to “Heckuva Job Brownie” heading FEMA and how well that all worked out…). But the alternatives aren’t so hot either. It’s like being told to choose one of three doors, but there’s a hungry tiger behind all three…

If you’ve got a reasonable way to assuage my concerns, by all means do so. PLEASE do so. And you might not only sway me, but maybe others looking in. In the meantime, I’ll wait for the *ahem* kooks to descend and try to have me for dinner…

Yes, Ron Paul polls low. So did McCain at one point. Most voters are not political junkies. Most voters go with the flow.

If the mainstream news and GOP decided to back Paul (which they won’t) you can bet Ron Paul would be hitting home runs right now.

Here’s the thing – Ron Paul is the only chance Republicans have of getting a Republican in office. If the talking heads started supporting Ron Paul, his % would go up dramatically.

So, yes, it’s sort of a Catch 22. But nothing changes the fact that neither McCain nor Huckabee could ever win a general election. The only people who can are Ron Paul, Obama, and Hillary.

Who are you voting for again?

Yes, us Paul supporters are crazy. Heck, you can even quote one of us as proof.

Meanwhile… McCain is some sort of bizarre hybrid of Dr. Strangelove and Joe Lieberman who can’t stop repeating ‘My friends, I was a foot soldier in the Reagan revolution’. And then we’ve got Huckabee, who believes the Earth is 6,000 years old.

Neither McCain nor Huckabee could EVER win a general election – because not only will half the base defect, but the Democrats would eat them both alive.

Ron Paul, on the other hand, could. If the GOP backed him. He draws support from both Independents and Democrats and Republicans.

But we’re the crazy ones. Sure we are.

“Perhaps it is because you are a jerk?”

Or not. The question asked, although I don’t recall my exact wording, was along the lines of “Why do you feel that Ron Paul is still a viable candidate when he has been polling in the single digit percentages” and cited what the polling numbers had been up to that point. The response to that fairly straightforward and honest question was a rant that ended with a comment that when the revolution comes I would be tried for treason.

“Do you really think you deserve respect when you don’t give respect? I can tell by your tone here that you were most likely VERY condescending and cocky when you “asked a simple question.””

No, I’ve simply become very condescending and cocky due to my treatment by so-called “Patriots” that will gladly stick a shiv into someone for having genuine questions that deserve answers, whether asked by a Paul supporter or by ANYONE.

“Maybe, just maybe if you didn’t refer to Ron Paul supporters as kooks and nutjobs, they would respond respectfully.”

Maybe if you read my posts you’d have a clue. You might note my use of the word “some”, which, to an intelligent reader, indicates exactly what it means – SOME. Not all. There are intelligent, reasonable Paul supporters out there and I’ve had some reasonable intelligent exchanges with them. The sad fact is that for every such exchange I’ve had I’ve had half a dozen smackdowns with the lunatic fringe of Truthers, Xenophobes, Racists, and outright Loons that seem to have flocked to the Paul banner. These are the ones that threaten that anyone asking a question instead of thumping their chest digitally and swearing undying allegiance to the one-and-only Ron Paul with all-caps with Treason trials, imprisonment, violence (I don’t care how much you might disagree with me, making personal threats against ANYONE is just plain uncalled for). Now, if you go in for that crap, then yes, you are a nutjob, plain and simple.

“Why were you hanging around the Ron Paul forums if you aren’t a supporter? To agitate and pick fights. And you got one.”

See? This is why Paul pulls such low numbers in the primaries. The truth is, James, that I was on such forums in an attempt to LEARN. Isn’t that what Ron Paul supporters are constantly bemoaning – the fact that if only people KNEW about Ron Paul, they’d vote for him? I was there to ask and honest question about why a person should support Paul, who was pulling very low numbers, rather than throw their vote to another candidate that may have a better chance at the nomination. But apparently according to you and others of your ilk, asking questions about the Good Doctor is capital heresy. And frankly, while Paul might himself be a good man, and while he may have some interesting ideas what I’ve learned over recent months hasn’t convinced me he’d be good president. And the rabid cult-member types that harass, insult and threaten anyone that doesn’t swallow Paul hook, line and sinker do not help one bit.

“And you’re surprised?”

Frankly, yes I was. I don’t usually expect threats of treason trials and violence when asking about the nomination prospects of a political candidate. Do you?

“Idiot. Go fuck yourself. Go play with your Hillary doll. ”

I can’t. You haven’t returned it yet.

Perhaps it is because you are a jerk? Do you really think you deserve respect when you don’t give respect? I can tell by your tone here that you were most likely VERY condescending and cocky when you “asked a simple question.”

Maybe, just maybe if you didn’t refer to Ron Paul supporters as kooks and nutjobs, they would respond respectfully.

Why were you hanging around the Ron Paul forums if you aren’t a supporter? To agitate and pick fights. And you got one.

And you’re surprised?

Idiot. Go fuck yourself. Go play with your Hillary doll.

That’s the only level of respect that you deserve.

Paul will campaign in washington etc., He did campaign in the state already. He is campaigning to WIN, and has no day off as the link referred to. And who told you, Doug, that there are no other people campaigning for him (newsflash: there are! at least two who endorsed him, one a household name as Barry Goldwater jr. – (who did not give his endorsement to Bush in 2000 BTW).
In NH and elsewhere many of the anti-war camp int he GOP voted for McCain, as they thought he was a maverick that disagreed with Bush. Wait till they are at the conference and find out who the real war-monger is and who is the prince of peace and voice of reason. Get the idea? :-)

It’s ironic that one of Paul’s biggest handicaps is some of his own supporters. I mean, every candidate has their lunatic fringe of backers, but Paul seems to have almost cornered the market this time.

Case in point – in asking an honest question about why Paul should be considered a viable candidate when after the first several races he was pulling single and low-double digit finishes, I was told by one Paulestinian that I would be tried for treason when the revolution comes. Ohhhh-kayyyy…..thanks for playing.

And on the Paul website when the newsletter story hit the papers, some honestly concerned and confused Paul supporters were, for lack of a better description, flogged to within a digital inch of their lives by the fanatics. Third case in point – some of them seem to think that the best way to make converts is to refer to anyone that disagrees (or even questions) anything to do with Paul as “sheeple”, “morons”, etc. Oddly enough, this just seems to anger people rather than convert them.

Not enough is heard from the rational wing of Paul supporters – all the general public sees are the fanatics and it turns them off.

WE did.

You’re obviously just an idiot.

And Huckabee is next. Feb. 13th.

Retard.

What? You think a bunch of guys who alienated the swing voters in pretty much every single primary are suddenly going to convince a bunch of delegates to defect on their vote?

I appologize for being such a poor communicator myself. I did not mean to imply that the people filling McCain’s delegate slots were true-blue McCainiacs who could somehow be convinced to give their precious votes to Ron Paul.

I meant to imply that the people filling McCain’s delegate slots were true-blue Paulunteers who simply *said* they would be happy to support McCain (or Thompson, or Romney, or whoever) Especially in LA, where McCain had trouble filling delegate slots at the end.

Kind of like what happened in WV, where even though Huckabee ostensibly won all 18 delegates, 3 of those Huckabee delegates will actually be voting Ron Paul at national convention.

I promise you it will happen in my state too. The primary vote doesn’t mean crap. Only 3 delegates are awarded by the primary vote. The other 24 are elected at county conventions. Some of these counties (like mine) don’t have *any* functional GOP organization. It is wide open to the first yahoo that says he wants to do the work (like me.)

It doesn’t matter if Ron Paul comes in 2nd, or 3rd, or even gains enough of a % to be entitled to a single delegate. My state will have at least one vote for Ron Paul (legally if it looks like he can hang on through the first ballot)

A whole bunch of us yahoos will be at state convention (from various counties) and voting for the same slate of delegates.

And I still say that of all the candidates in the race, McCain has the most potential to have his temper show up at an inopportune moment.

We’ll see who’s right.

Later.

We (his supporters) aren’t going to stop. We aren’t going to give up. We aren’t going to be bullied, insulted, or scared into silence.

Nobody’s going to have to bully you…after this election nobody’s going to give a damn what the Paulestinians have to say because nobody pays attention to bitter-enders who back losing candidates. They’ll just ignore you.

Delegates might be pledged to vote for McCain, but not have any intention of nominating, nor duty to nominate, him.

That is the cry of the truly desperate. Sorry, but no…the candidates pledged to McCain are simply not going to defect.

We’ve been accused of spamming internet polls, and slamming straw polls. What makes you think we’re above packing a convention?

What? You think a bunch of guys who alienated the swing voters in pretty much every single primary are suddenly going to convince a bunch of delegates to defect on their vote? What world do you live in? People see Ron Paul as a fringe candidate because his most visible supporters are a bunch of unlikeable loons. He’s generally been either hated or ignored and, unlike Goldwater, Ron Paul doesn’t have the charisma or speaking ability to be able to persuade the crowd otherwise. If you pull the same kind of crap at the convention that you did in the primaries all that’s going to happen is security is going to bounce every last “truther”, racist and whackjob out of there while the rest of the GOP cheers. And if you’re very lucky the bouncers won’t use your heads to open the doors when they’re chucking you.

So let me see if I have this right…

Ron Paul is throwing in the towel because he is staying in the DC / VA / MD area, but Clinton, Obama, McCain (all of whom have votes to show up for) and Huckabee (sometimes it’s nice to be retired) are running real campaigns for doing the exact same thing???

Is that really your position?

C’mon! you are so transparent it isn’t even funny. Ron Paul isn’t going away. We (his supporters) aren’t going to stop. We aren’t going to give up. We aren’t going to be bullied, insulted, or scared into silence.

McCain may win the VA election, but what will it matter if the delegates that are selected are actually Ron Paul supporters? What are the penalties for being a faithless delegate? Jail time? Fines? – Not usually. Usually just a stern lecture, and you can’t ever be an elector ever again…. awwwww.

Not one single primary vote counts for a hill of beans!

The only vote that counts is the one in St. Paul (not Minneapolis) in early September. All sorts of dynamics can play out (Delegates might be pledged to vote for McCain, but not have any intention of nominating, nor duty to nominate, him.

We’ve been accused of spamming internet polls, and slamming straw polls. What makes you think we’re above packing a convention?

Later.

And in Feb. 2007 you posted a thread called “Why John McCain Will Lose.” Doug, I really think you would make one helluva local weatherman with your forecasting ability.