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	<title>Comments on: Aren&#8217;t Libertarians Being a Bit Hypocritical and Hoplophobic?</title>
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	<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2008/09/05/arent-libertarians-being-a-bit-hypocritical-and-hoplophobic/</link>
	<description>Life. Liberty. Property. Defending individual freedom and liberty, one post at a time.</description>
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		<title>By: David Z</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2008/09/05/arent-libertarians-being-a-bit-hypocritical-and-hoplophobic/#comment-60062</link>
		<dc:creator>David Z</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Sep 2008 02:26:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=2714#comment-60062</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Tarran asks, &quot;If we are to defend the individual’s right to own and play with such a monstrous weapon as a .50 cal rifle, shouldn’t we extend the same courtesy to someone who happens to be a policeman? Why can we trust a guy insane enough to buy a .50 cal rifle at a cost of I don’t know how many tens of thousands of dollars while not trusting a guy who happens to join a police force?&quot;

Why should we trust a guy insane enough to think it&#039;s OK to take a job, the ultimate purpose of which is to shoot people who disagree with his employer?

game, set, match.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tarran asks, &#8220;If we are to defend the individual’s right to own and play with such a monstrous weapon as a .50 cal rifle, shouldn’t we extend the same courtesy to someone who happens to be a policeman? Why can we trust a guy insane enough to buy a .50 cal rifle at a cost of I don’t know how many tens of thousands of dollars while not trusting a guy who happens to join a police force?&#8221;</p>
<p>Why should we trust a guy insane enough to think it&#8217;s OK to take a job, the ultimate purpose of which is to shoot people who disagree with his employer?</p>
<p>game, set, match.</p>
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		<title>By: Kristopher</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2008/09/05/arent-libertarians-being-a-bit-hypocritical-and-hoplophobic/#comment-60016</link>
		<dc:creator>Kristopher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Sep 2008 19:04:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=2714#comment-60016</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Wanting to disarm the state and its apparatus is very libertarian.

Cops should be able to purchase, own, and carry any weapon they want ... while off-duty.

On duty, they should all be disarmed. If they need firearms to deal with a malefactor, they should call up the local neighborhood militia, and direct them as needed.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wanting to disarm the state and its apparatus is very libertarian.</p>
<p>Cops should be able to purchase, own, and carry any weapon they want &#8230; while off-duty.</p>
<p>On duty, they should all be disarmed. If they need firearms to deal with a malefactor, they should call up the local neighborhood militia, and direct them as needed.</p>
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		<title>By: Stephen Littau</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2008/09/05/arent-libertarians-being-a-bit-hypocritical-and-hoplophobic/#comment-60010</link>
		<dc:creator>Stephen Littau</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 Sep 2008 04:07:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=2714#comment-60010</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Great post tarran!

&quot;Gun Control Is Not The Answer - Ending Police Immunity To Prosecution Is&quot; 

I couldn&#039;t agree more. In Radley Balko&#039;s &quot;Overkill&quot; one of his recommendations is for each jurisdiction to have an independant citizen&#039;s review board with full supeana powers. I think that would be a great way to keep the police honest and hopefully end this double standard (which we both write about often).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post tarran!</p>
<p>&#8220;Gun Control Is Not The Answer &#8211; Ending Police Immunity To Prosecution Is&#8221; </p>
<p>I couldn&#8217;t agree more. In Radley Balko&#8217;s &#8220;Overkill&#8221; one of his recommendations is for each jurisdiction to have an independant citizen&#8217;s review board with full supeana powers. I think that would be a great way to keep the police honest and hopefully end this double standard (which we both write about often).</p>
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		<title>By: tarran</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2008/09/05/arent-libertarians-being-a-bit-hypocritical-and-hoplophobic/#comment-59995</link>
		<dc:creator>tarran</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 16:24:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=2714#comment-59995</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Jed,

You are quite correct.  There are lots of different factors at work simultaneously. The problem is a cultural one, and will only go away when that culture goes away.

I think, however, that ending the double standard would create a great deal of incentive for policemen to change their culture to one that is more civilized and peaceable.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jed,</p>
<p>You are quite correct.  There are lots of different factors at work simultaneously. The problem is a cultural one, and will only go away when that culture goes away.</p>
<p>I think, however, that ending the double standard would create a great deal of incentive for policemen to change their culture to one that is more civilized and peaceable.</p>
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		<title>By: tarran</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2008/09/05/arent-libertarians-being-a-bit-hypocritical-and-hoplophobic/#comment-59994</link>
		<dc:creator>tarran</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 16:12:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=2714#comment-59994</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Oh Chris,

I&#039;m sure we agree on much. I tend to focus on the areas that are controversial because,
1) It&#039;s fun,
2) I am trying to differentiate my brand from Brad&#039;s, and he doesn&#039;t make it easy.  I strongly suspect that despite his hot denials, Brad is a closet anarchist.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh Chris,</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure we agree on much. I tend to focus on the areas that are controversial because,<br />
1) It&#8217;s fun,<br />
2) I am trying to differentiate my brand from Brad&#8217;s, and he doesn&#8217;t make it easy.  I strongly suspect that despite his hot denials, Brad is a closet anarchist.</p>
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		<title>By: tarran</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2008/09/05/arent-libertarians-being-a-bit-hypocritical-and-hoplophobic/#comment-59993</link>
		<dc:creator>tarran</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 16:03:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=2714#comment-59993</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thomas,

Actually, if you are interested in the comprehensive list of the weapons I think it&#039;s OK for you to have, you should read my first post on The Liberty Papers, &lt;em&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/04/21/the-w-88-thats-perfect-for-home-defense/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;The W-88? That’s perfect for home defense&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/em&gt;.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thomas,</p>
<p>Actually, if you are interested in the comprehensive list of the weapons I think it&#8217;s OK for you to have, you should read my first post on The Liberty Papers, <em><a href="http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2007/04/21/the-w-88-thats-perfect-for-home-defense/" rel="nofollow">The W-88? That’s perfect for home defense</a></em>.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2008/09/05/arent-libertarians-being-a-bit-hypocritical-and-hoplophobic/#comment-59992</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 15:21:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=2714#comment-59992</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[By god... Tarran and I agree on something?

Oh and any time a sworn law enforcement officer (or other agent of the state) calls unsworn persons (or those who are not agents of the state) &quot;civilians&quot;, they should be slapped across the face, hard.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>By god&#8230; Tarran and I agree on something?</p>
<p>Oh and any time a sworn law enforcement officer (or other agent of the state) calls unsworn persons (or those who are not agents of the state) &#8220;civilians&#8221;, they should be slapped across the face, hard.</p>
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		<title>By: FreedomSight &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Tarran on the &#8220;Big Police Weapons&#8221; Thing</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2008/09/05/arent-libertarians-being-a-bit-hypocritical-and-hoplophobic/#comment-59990</link>
		<dc:creator>FreedomSight &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Tarran on the &#8220;Big Police Weapons&#8221; Thing</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 13:24:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=2714#comment-59990</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] off their badass selves, tarran, at The Liberty Papers, has posted a nicely done commentary. Aren’t Libertarians Being a Bit Hypocritical and Hoplophobic? tags: [abuse of power, [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] off their badass selves, tarran, at The Liberty Papers, has posted a nicely done commentary. Aren’t Libertarians Being a Bit Hypocritical and Hoplophobic? tags: [abuse of power, [...]</p>
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		<title>By: jed</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2008/09/05/arent-libertarians-being-a-bit-hypocritical-and-hoplophobic/#comment-59989</link>
		<dc:creator>jed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 13:15:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=2714#comment-59989</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Nice piece, Tarran. And I agree with the idea, taken by itself, that the cops ought to be able to buy/use any weapon / armament / vehicle that other citizens can go out and buy. However, it doesn&#039;t end up working that way. First off, that gun is full-auto. Yes, I know that such are not completely banned, but the high level of regulation, plus the post &#039;86 ban, amount to a very high barrier that the average Joe will find prohibitive. And some jurisdictions do completely ban possession.

But more important is the positive feedback loop of self aggrandizement. This is the worst aspect of the militarization of the police. You mention the double standard of prosecution and accountability. Just part of the same issue, which is that the police forces consider themselves above the citizenry. No doubt there are individual officers who don&#039;t feel that way, but collectively, it&#039;s quite obvious, at least to me. So it becomes a &quot;we&#039;re superior because we have better toys and since we have better toys we&#039;re superior&quot; sort of loop. It just feeds itself, with help from the politicians and media. And the worst part of it is that it&#039;s our tax dollars that are being spent to create and reinforce this elitism.

Another aspect of this attitude problem is that it can infect even the most well intentioned of those who join the police force. Once immersed in the culture, it becomes difficult to not absorb it.

As for the .50 providing &quot;just as much sport&quot; as a  smaller gun, well ... I surely do enjoy plinking away with my .22s, but the .50 is at a whole &#039;nother level. Kinda like the difference between pine-box derby and NASCAR, ya know? :D]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice piece, Tarran. And I agree with the idea, taken by itself, that the cops ought to be able to buy/use any weapon / armament / vehicle that other citizens can go out and buy. However, it doesn&#8217;t end up working that way. First off, that gun is full-auto. Yes, I know that such are not completely banned, but the high level of regulation, plus the post &#8217;86 ban, amount to a very high barrier that the average Joe will find prohibitive. And some jurisdictions do completely ban possession.</p>
<p>But more important is the positive feedback loop of self aggrandizement. This is the worst aspect of the militarization of the police. You mention the double standard of prosecution and accountability. Just part of the same issue, which is that the police forces consider themselves above the citizenry. No doubt there are individual officers who don&#8217;t feel that way, but collectively, it&#8217;s quite obvious, at least to me. So it becomes a &#8220;we&#8217;re superior because we have better toys and since we have better toys we&#8217;re superior&#8221; sort of loop. It just feeds itself, with help from the politicians and media. And the worst part of it is that it&#8217;s our tax dollars that are being spent to create and reinforce this elitism.</p>
<p>Another aspect of this attitude problem is that it can infect even the most well intentioned of those who join the police force. Once immersed in the culture, it becomes difficult to not absorb it.</p>
<p>As for the .50 providing &#8220;just as much sport&#8221; as a  smaller gun, well &#8230; I surely do enjoy plinking away with my .22s, but the .50 is at a whole &#8216;nother level. Kinda like the difference between pine-box derby and NASCAR, ya know? :D</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff Molby</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2008/09/05/arent-libertarians-being-a-bit-hypocritical-and-hoplophobic/#comment-59988</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff Molby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 05:05:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=2714#comment-59988</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt;Thanks for letting me know what weapons it’s OK for me to have.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Thanks for reading the entire piece. 

Well done, tarran.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Thanks for letting me know what weapons it’s OK for me to have.</p></blockquote>
<p>Thanks for reading the entire piece. </p>
<p>Well done, tarran.</p>
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		<title>By: thomasblair</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2008/09/05/arent-libertarians-being-a-bit-hypocritical-and-hoplophobic/#comment-59987</link>
		<dc:creator>thomasblair</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 03:47:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=2714#comment-59987</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt;The .50 cal rifle, being almost worthless for hunting (blowing a part your prey leaves very little cookable meat), overkill for self defense, and providing just as much sport as a smaller gun when it comes to plinking away at targets, is similarly inappropriate for the regular citizenry.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Thanks for letting me know what weapons it&#039;s OK for me to have.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>The .50 cal rifle, being almost worthless for hunting (blowing a part your prey leaves very little cookable meat), overkill for self defense, and providing just as much sport as a smaller gun when it comes to plinking away at targets, is similarly inappropriate for the regular citizenry.</p></blockquote>
<p>Thanks for letting me know what weapons it&#8217;s OK for me to have.</p>
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