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	<title>Comments on: Good gun nuts.  Bad gun nuts.</title>
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	<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/</link>
	<description>Life. Liberty. Property. Defending individual freedom and liberty, one post at a time.</description>
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		<title>By: The Liberty Papers &#187;Blog Archive &#187; DHS Report: &#8220;&#8230;has likely spurred African Americans—as well as law-abiding Americans&#8230;&#8221;</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/#comment-65040</link>
		<dc:creator>The Liberty Papers &#187;Blog Archive &#187; DHS Report: &#8220;&#8230;has likely spurred African Americans—as well as law-abiding Americans&#8230;&#8221;</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Apr 2009 15:02:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=4957#comment-65040</guid>
		<description>[...] agreed with Weigel (specifically about the gun show to which he refers, even) about how bad the more extreme folks who tend to show at gun shows can make the movement [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] agreed with Weigel (specifically about the gun show to which he refers, even) about how bad the more extreme folks who tend to show at gun shows can make the movement [...]</p>
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		<title>By: southernjames</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/#comment-64875</link>
		<dc:creator>southernjames</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Apr 2009 12:10:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=4957#comment-64875</guid>
		<description>Bingo Toaster.  

Yep, John you&#039;ve finally got it.  I&#039;ll defend your right to play gangsta rap as loud as you want.  LIBERTY for all, even including John!  But I don&#039;t want you playing it at 2 a.m., right outside my bedroom window.  

Sorry if that makes you feel like you&#039;ve lost your Liberty and are therefore oppressed.

I&#039;ll defend your right to march with your fellow Neo-Nazis or whatever floats your boat.  Liberty, baby!!  Even for John!   But am I out of bounds and apparently an oppressor and a &quot;hypocrite&quot; if I request that you do it on your own time, on your own street or public park, and get your own permit?  

Will I physically attack you, or try to get you arrested, or try to find some legal means to PREVENT you and your fellow goose-schteppers from gathering at our tea-party protest?  

Nope.  I won&#039;t.  So....Liberty for all, even for  John!!  Satisfied? 

Am I allowed to exercise my OWN Liberty and hold up and sign with an arrow pointed at you saying &quot;he doesn&#039;t speak for me&quot; at the tea party protest?   Or,  is your definition of &quot;Liberty&quot; such that we are all required to give dutiful and equal &quot;respect&quot; and honor ALL points of view - across the entire spectrum?   And not marginalize or mock or ridicule or disrespect anyone - even the sheet wearers,  911 Truthers, etc.?  That seems to be your argument.  If so, a guy who clearly implies that Christians are delusional idiots who believe in fairy tales by saying they believe what HE has decreed to be  &quot;nonsense&quot;  shouldn&#039;t  be so quick to throw out the &quot;hypocrisy&quot; label.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bingo Toaster.  </p>
<p>Yep, John you&#8217;ve finally got it.  I&#8217;ll defend your right to play gangsta rap as loud as you want.  LIBERTY for all, even including John!  But I don&#8217;t want you playing it at 2 a.m., right outside my bedroom window.  </p>
<p>Sorry if that makes you feel like you&#8217;ve lost your Liberty and are therefore oppressed.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ll defend your right to march with your fellow Neo-Nazis or whatever floats your boat.  Liberty, baby!!  Even for John!   But am I out of bounds and apparently an oppressor and a &#8220;hypocrite&#8221; if I request that you do it on your own time, on your own street or public park, and get your own permit?  </p>
<p>Will I physically attack you, or try to get you arrested, or try to find some legal means to PREVENT you and your fellow goose-schteppers from gathering at our tea-party protest?  </p>
<p>Nope.  I won&#8217;t.  So&#8230;.Liberty for all, even for  John!!  Satisfied? </p>
<p>Am I allowed to exercise my OWN Liberty and hold up and sign with an arrow pointed at you saying &#8220;he doesn&#8217;t speak for me&#8221; at the tea party protest?   Or,  is your definition of &#8220;Liberty&#8221; such that we are all required to give dutiful and equal &#8220;respect&#8221; and honor ALL points of view &#8211; across the entire spectrum?   And not marginalize or mock or ridicule or disrespect anyone &#8211; even the sheet wearers,  911 Truthers, etc.?  That seems to be your argument.  If so, a guy who clearly implies that Christians are delusional idiots who believe in fairy tales by saying they believe what HE has decreed to be  &#8220;nonsense&#8221;  shouldn&#8217;t  be so quick to throw out the &#8220;hypocrisy&#8221; label.</p>
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		<title>By: toaster</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/#comment-64863</link>
		<dc:creator>toaster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Apr 2009 03:40:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=4957#comment-64863</guid>
		<description>Late to this, but here&#039;s my two cents.

John:  It&#039;s not about liberty because you can be there, no one said you can&#039;t.  We just don&#039;t want you there if you&#039;re not going to respect our goals and leave your personal trip at the door.  You can do it, we just don&#039;t want you to.  It&#039;s about respect, not liberty.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Late to this, but here&#8217;s my two cents.</p>
<p>John:  It&#8217;s not about liberty because you can be there, no one said you can&#8217;t.  We just don&#8217;t want you there if you&#8217;re not going to respect our goals and leave your personal trip at the door.  You can do it, we just don&#8217;t want you to.  It&#8217;s about respect, not liberty.</p>
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		<title>By: John Newman</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/#comment-64850</link>
		<dc:creator>John Newman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 22:32:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=4957#comment-64850</guid>
		<description>Well southernjames, I&#039;m pretty dense and ain&#039;t the world&#039;s best reader, but I got brains enough to know contradiction and hypocrisy when I see it as presented in your last response. I can translate it fairly clearly, I am all for Liberty for everyone, just not where I am.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well southernjames, I&#8217;m pretty dense and ain&#8217;t the world&#8217;s best reader, but I got brains enough to know contradiction and hypocrisy when I see it as presented in your last response. I can translate it fairly clearly, I am all for Liberty for everyone, just not where I am.</p>
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		<title>By: southernjames</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/#comment-64843</link>
		<dc:creator>southernjames</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 20:15:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=4957#comment-64843</guid>
		<description>John,

You are either dense, or you are incapable or unwilling to read English, or your are intentionally not addressing the points made in rebuttal to your proclamations.  Which is it?  

For the final time, it has been stated REPEATEDLY that people like me DO believe in &quot;liberty for everyone&quot; including - yes, even you and your fellow &quot;sheet wearers.&quot; 

Explain to me HOW my not wanting you and your fellow sheet wearers to be alongside me at my anti-war rally, or at my anti-trillion dollar bail-out Tea Party protest, so that YOUR message of &quot;white supremacy&quot; does not dilute, pollute, or distract from MY anti-big government message - impairs upon your Liberty, one bit.  

Answer the question.    

I don&#039;t want that band-wagon hopper Newt Gingrich at my Tea Party either.  Because he represents Big Government, and I don&#039;t want our movement to be associated with Country Club Rockefellar Beltway Republicans.  

So you know what this means, don&#039;t you....yes..

Quick John!! Hurry!  You&#039;d better write to Newt and warn him that we don&#039;t believe in Liberty for him!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John,</p>
<p>You are either dense, or you are incapable or unwilling to read English, or your are intentionally not addressing the points made in rebuttal to your proclamations.  Which is it?  </p>
<p>For the final time, it has been stated REPEATEDLY that people like me DO believe in &#8220;liberty for everyone&#8221; including &#8211; yes, even you and your fellow &#8220;sheet wearers.&#8221; </p>
<p>Explain to me HOW my not wanting you and your fellow sheet wearers to be alongside me at my anti-war rally, or at my anti-trillion dollar bail-out Tea Party protest, so that YOUR message of &#8220;white supremacy&#8221; does not dilute, pollute, or distract from MY anti-big government message &#8211; impairs upon your Liberty, one bit.  </p>
<p>Answer the question.    </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t want that band-wagon hopper Newt Gingrich at my Tea Party either.  Because he represents Big Government, and I don&#8217;t want our movement to be associated with Country Club Rockefellar Beltway Republicans.  </p>
<p>So you know what this means, don&#8217;t you&#8230;.yes..</p>
<p>Quick John!! Hurry!  You&#8217;d better write to Newt and warn him that we don&#8217;t believe in Liberty for him!!!</p>
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		<title>By: The Liberty Papers &#187;Blog Archive &#187; The über-secret attempt by ACORN to tell Obama the names of people attending Tea Parties (and much more)</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/#comment-64837</link>
		<dc:creator>The Liberty Papers &#187;Blog Archive &#187; The über-secret attempt by ACORN to tell Obama the names of people attending Tea Parties (and much more)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 15:51:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=4957#comment-64837</guid>
		<description>[...] Stephen Gordon: John, I never stated that liberty doesn&#8217;t apply to everyone. My point is about how best to sell... [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Stephen Gordon: John, I never stated that liberty doesn&#8217;t apply to everyone. My point is about how best to sell&#8230; [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Stephen Gordon</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/#comment-64836</link>
		<dc:creator>Stephen Gordon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 14:59:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=4957#comment-64836</guid>
		<description>John,

I never stated that liberty doesn&#039;t apply to everyone.

My point is about how best to sell the message, not whether or not one has the right to do whatever they want, so long as they aren&#039;t harming others in the process.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John,</p>
<p>I never stated that liberty doesn&#8217;t apply to everyone.</p>
<p>My point is about how best to sell the message, not whether or not one has the right to do whatever they want, so long as they aren&#8217;t harming others in the process.</p>
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		<title>By: John Newman</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/#comment-64834</link>
		<dc:creator>John Newman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 14:07:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=4957#comment-64834</guid>
		<description>Yes, Liberty for ALL means everyone. Except sheet wearers, swastika wearers, politically incorrect slogan t-shirt wearers, people who only have one tooth, bikers, anyone with tattoos or piercings, winos, crackheads and ho&#039;s. Liberty for All means well groomed preppies and people who are dressed like they are ready for their own funeral.
The nihilist denies the existence of the word, ALL.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, Liberty for ALL means everyone. Except sheet wearers, swastika wearers, politically incorrect slogan t-shirt wearers, people who only have one tooth, bikers, anyone with tattoos or piercings, winos, crackheads and ho&#8217;s. Liberty for All means well groomed preppies and people who are dressed like they are ready for their own funeral.<br />
The nihilist denies the existence of the word, ALL.</p>
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		<title>By: VRB</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/#comment-64830</link>
		<dc:creator>VRB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 03:56:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=4957#comment-64830</guid>
		<description>I think some mistake nihilism for liberty.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think some mistake nihilism for liberty.</p>
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		<title>By: Bill Mortlock</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/#comment-64828</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill Mortlock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 22:50:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=4957#comment-64828</guid>
		<description>If you REALLY read ANY blogs then sjrpillinois.wordpress.com might just be up your alley.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you REALLY read ANY blogs then sjrpillinois.wordpress.com might just be up your alley.</p>
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		<title>By: Bill Mortlock</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/#comment-64827</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill Mortlock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 22:39:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=4957#comment-64827</guid>
		<description>IF you ARE a Constitutional Conservative, plz read my blog &amp; tell me what YOU think. 
IF YOUR beliefs include that if it&#039;s NOT enumerated...you CAN&quot;T DO IT!! If YOU believe that &quot;WE THE PEOPLE&quot; control this country, plz read my blog. If YOU believe it&#039;s time to STOP the Liberals(Communists),plz read my blog.
www.sjrpillinois.wordpress.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>IF you ARE a Constitutional Conservative, plz read my blog &amp; tell me what YOU think.<br />
IF YOUR beliefs include that if it&#8217;s NOT enumerated&#8230;you CAN&#8221;T DO IT!! If YOU believe that &#8220;WE THE PEOPLE&#8221; control this country, plz read my blog. If YOU believe it&#8217;s time to STOP the Liberals(Communists),plz read my blog.<br />
<a href="http://www.sjrpillinois.wordpress.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.sjrpillinois.wordpress.com</a></p>
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		<title>By: Bill Mortlock</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/#comment-64826</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill Mortlock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 22:31:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=4957#comment-64826</guid>
		<description>Although there ARE &quot;Kooks&quot; out there, I believe that they make up only 2-5% of the total of the &quot;Bubba Club&quot; to which I PROUDLY belong. 
If living in &quot;Fly-over Country&quot;(as the Political Elite like to refer it), then I consider myself in GOOD company. I didn&#039;t see any of THEM go to Korea, Vietnam, or Iraq. In fact, they did all they could to keep from it!
I never had the &quot;Honor&quot; of going to ANY of those campaigns,but, I would have! I blog &amp; you read!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Although there ARE &#8220;Kooks&#8221; out there, I believe that they make up only 2-5% of the total of the &#8220;Bubba Club&#8221; to which I PROUDLY belong.<br />
If living in &#8220;Fly-over Country&#8221;(as the Political Elite like to refer it), then I consider myself in GOOD company. I didn&#8217;t see any of THEM go to Korea, Vietnam, or Iraq. In fact, they did all they could to keep from it!<br />
I never had the &#8220;Honor&#8221; of going to ANY of those campaigns,but, I would have! I blog &amp; you read!</p>
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		<title>By: southernjames</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/#comment-64817</link>
		<dc:creator>southernjames</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 14:52:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=4957#comment-64817</guid>
		<description>John, I believe that the fight for liberty for all, IS hurt if those with out in left field fringe views (KKK members, 911 Truthers, etc.), are &quot;associated&quot; with a particular cause. 

Because it is a tactic the Leftist anti-liberty totalitarians already use, constantly, to demonize their opponents.  

One example:  Via a propaganda narrative, it became a given in too many peoples&#039; minds that Tim McVeigh was driven to his murders by Rush Limbaugh and his &quot;hate speech&quot; on the radio.  So it stands to reason that people like him should be driven off the air.  Right?  Plant the idea in peoples&#039; heads.  Associate and connect the word &quot;hate&quot; with &quot;conservative talk radio.&quot;  

Serfdom will arrive in stages, not overnight.  

The totalitarians want gun control. (actually gun elimination, eventually).  So - they do their best to scare the average voter.  How?  By creating an image - a &quot;narrative&quot; which is an attempt to get people to ASSOCIATE pro-2nd Amendment gun owners of America with &quot;extreme right wing&quot; (aka &quot;racists&quot;), &quot;militia&quot; types, &quot;domestic terrorists,&quot; &quot;Timothy McVeigh&quot; mentality, etc.    If you favor concealed carry, and oppose the banning of those &quot;scary&quot; rifles - articles in places like Newsweek or on CNN will characterize you as an &quot;Angry White Man,&quot; or a &quot;Southern Redneck,&quot; or you are simply perhaps, in the words of Dear Leader,  a poor naive ignorant Schlep, pathetically &quot;clinging&quot; to your &quot;guns and religion.&quot;  Your betters know better and know what&#039;s best for you. 

I favor full freedom of association, freedom of speech, and the liberty for anybody to be as big a Nazi as he wants to be.  

But would or would you not agree that it does not HELP the pro-2nd Amendment,gun ownership advocacy if the  media propaganda stereotypes are reinforced and validated by Swastika flag wavers becoming &quot;associated&quot; with them?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John, I believe that the fight for liberty for all, IS hurt if those with out in left field fringe views (KKK members, 911 Truthers, etc.), are &#8220;associated&#8221; with a particular cause. </p>
<p>Because it is a tactic the Leftist anti-liberty totalitarians already use, constantly, to demonize their opponents.  </p>
<p>One example:  Via a propaganda narrative, it became a given in too many peoples&#8217; minds that Tim McVeigh was driven to his murders by Rush Limbaugh and his &#8220;hate speech&#8221; on the radio.  So it stands to reason that people like him should be driven off the air.  Right?  Plant the idea in peoples&#8217; heads.  Associate and connect the word &#8220;hate&#8221; with &#8220;conservative talk radio.&#8221;  </p>
<p>Serfdom will arrive in stages, not overnight.  </p>
<p>The totalitarians want gun control. (actually gun elimination, eventually).  So &#8211; they do their best to scare the average voter.  How?  By creating an image &#8211; a &#8220;narrative&#8221; which is an attempt to get people to ASSOCIATE pro-2nd Amendment gun owners of America with &#8220;extreme right wing&#8221; (aka &#8220;racists&#8221;), &#8220;militia&#8221; types, &#8220;domestic terrorists,&#8221; &#8220;Timothy McVeigh&#8221; mentality, etc.    If you favor concealed carry, and oppose the banning of those &#8220;scary&#8221; rifles &#8211; articles in places like Newsweek or on CNN will characterize you as an &#8220;Angry White Man,&#8221; or a &#8220;Southern Redneck,&#8221; or you are simply perhaps, in the words of Dear Leader,  a poor naive ignorant Schlep, pathetically &#8220;clinging&#8221; to your &#8220;guns and religion.&#8221;  Your betters know better and know what&#8217;s best for you. </p>
<p>I favor full freedom of association, freedom of speech, and the liberty for anybody to be as big a Nazi as he wants to be.  </p>
<p>But would or would you not agree that it does not HELP the pro-2nd Amendment,gun ownership advocacy if the  media propaganda stereotypes are reinforced and validated by Swastika flag wavers becoming &#8220;associated&#8221; with them?</p>
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		<title>By: John Newman</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/#comment-64816</link>
		<dc:creator>John Newman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 14:42:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=4957#comment-64816</guid>
		<description>Yes, I see what you mean. It would be entirely inappropriate for a slave owner to openly declare:
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, I see what you mean. It would be entirely inappropriate for a slave owner to openly declare:<br />
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.</p>
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		<title>By: tfr</title>
		<link>http://www.thelibertypapers.org/2009/04/06/good-gun-nuts-bad-gun-nuts/#comment-64815</link>
		<dc:creator>tfr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 14:22:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thelibertypapers.org/?p=4957#comment-64815</guid>
		<description>Liberty For All is fine. Sanity and ability to process facts and reality from fantasy would be nice, too, especially if you expect those who can to trust you to decide or do anything important.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Liberty For All is fine. Sanity and ability to process facts and reality from fantasy would be nice, too, especially if you expect those who can to trust you to decide or do anything important.</p>
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